Covenants: Vivid Enviroment

OK, this boon states that it helps attract new grogs and such to the covenant. And, more specificly "provides a bonus to the calculations found in the governance chapter."

Now, I may infact be blind/stupid but the only calculations I can find in this chapter, are the loyalty calculations, which dosen't seem to be affected by enviroment at all.

Actually, I can't seem to find rules for attracting new grogs period, just buying them with base points.

What am I missing?

Yep, I've just noticed the same thing.

Morever, for a different topic, when the book talks about the covenant having multiple sources of income, it essentially forbids some combinations, such as agricolture and forest, unless the covenant's estate is large. However, no Boon giving the covenant a large estate is to be found in the Boon/Hook chapter.

On the subject of attracting grog and covenfolk, and of purchasing more at covenant generation, it's not entirely clear what, in fact, the cost in build points should be? I might be missing something, but surely servants, common craftsmen and fighting men should cost fewer points than exotic specialists?

They do, can't recall the page, but common craftsmen cost half their Craft Ability, while more exotic ones (glassblowers and incmakers etc) cost their Craft Ability. Servants and such are calculated based on the numbers of other people there, thus cost no build points... (now to hope today is not another Stupid Day for me :wink: )

I don't think you are missing anything. I think you've found one of the seams where two pieces of writing by different authors do not join as smoothly as could be hoped. This needs an errata. I'll write one an float it here.

The build costs for people are in a table right up the 7 or thereabouts. It lists the costs for everything.

Is it the same case for having multiple sources of income ?

Thanks for the quick response, I can assure my group that our boon actually does do something, I just don't know what yet. :slight_smile:

Thanks for the quick response, I can assure my group that our boon actually does do something, I just don't know what yet. :slight_smile:[/quote]

OK. As one of the authors involved, this is my fault, so please give them my apologies. How about this?

Erase the last two sentneces and replace them with:

The beauty of the locale provides a Situational Loyalty Modifer (p.38) of +10, which may stack with others for Aging modifers. It also allows a bonus of +1 on any roll to recruit new covenant residents, if they live in less attractive places.

Awsome! Thanks so much!

Nice errata materiel... :slight_smile: Thanks, we'll just have to move to a prettier place then, eh? :laughing:

That sounds right, it even sounds familiar, but I can't find it anywhere in the rules. Pages 63/4 of Covenants stipulate the numbers of servants required, but make no mention of how they should be acquired when generating one's covenant. That it addresses the number necessary could be taken to imply that they should cost something.

Likewise, though in some cases it's a matter of common sense, I can't seem to find a hard and fast rule delineating what constitutes an exotic specialist, as opposed to a common one. Nor can I find rules treating how trained grogs should be bought under this system; one could argue that thugs are easily aquired anywhere, and should as such come cheaply, or, conversely, that well-trained fighting men are hard to come by, and therefore expensive. Not being a mediaevalist, I have little idea of the relative ease with which one could, historically, hired scribes, swordsmen, wheelwrights or whatever.

This has been annoying me for some time, since I can't believe it's actually missing or left to assumption in the rules, but I just can't find it. I fear I'm having one very long, very stupid day...

I recall all of the costs being on page 7.

It varies by where you are...but basically if I noted that the Atlas webpage says "City and Guild" describes European trade, would you care to guess where the really detailled information on what is made where might be hidden.

The costs for grogs, with different classes of weapons training, are given in the Boons section and repeated in the accountancy chapter.

I can see nothing by way of explanation of page 7 for Covenants. If you mean the Creation Summary of page 5, the it breaks residents down into only two catergories; Teachers (Cost = Com+Teaching+Highest Ability)and Specialists(Cost = Highest Ability). I find it difficult to believe that all covenfolk, even grogs and domestic servants, above the baseline of one grog and two other covenfolk per magus are to be purchased by this method?

Yes, fair enough. That said, given that Covenants and other books make frequent use of the 'exotic' distinction, one might expect some definition of it, however loose, to be found within the book.

The Residents Boons and Hooks assign no particular numbers to the extra fighting men they provide. If this is to be at the discretion of the troupe, then it would be helpful for that to be explicitly stated somewhere.

Unless I'm looking in entirely the wrong place, the only points costs that I can see assigned to specialists and other covenfolk in chapter five are those on page 63 for determining their annual living expenses. Since these are entirely different from those given on page 5 (i.e. a specialist costs two or three points, depending on the covenant's season), I had not understood these to correspond to build point costs.

As it is, I am still in the dark as to how, presuming that every inhabitant of the covenant, however lowly, is not to be bought as a specialist, one purchases grogs and covenfolk with build points at the beginning of a saga.

As I understood it, the number of people would be determined freely by the troupe, as it would be payed for by the increased costs (in silver, rather than buildpoints).

If that is the case, that's fine. It would, however, have been helpful for this to have been explicitly stated somewhere in the Covenants book, given that, in previous editions, it was expected that grogs, servants and the like be paid for with build points, hence my assumption that this edition would require the same. That it is not specifically stated either way gives the impression, at least, of an omission, rather than a deliberate decision.

Moreover, it surprises me that a covenant building and management system which goes into such immense detail in most areas should leave so significant a detail to be approximated.