Hypothetical:
An urban criminal gang occasionally needs to dispose of a body.. They feed it to this piggery they control. They also arrange that the swine only go to feed the gang’s enemies.
Does an Internal Aura form?
No, but an Infernal one might.
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Is the gang either Jewish or Muslim?
Damn my auto-correct not letting ‘Infernal’ through.
I am thinking of setting this in Constantinople, with those opposed to the Crusader installed leadership.
So an ethnic group who don't eat pork makes sense. Thus Jews and Muslims are the most likely ethnic groups. Would there be others? Vegan Buddhists perhaps?
Vanishingly few Buddhists in Constantinople, or anywhere west of India.
Not many Muslims in Constantinople, either, although there are surely Jews.
This sort of thing doesn’t need to have a religious prohibition, though; it’s evil enough.
If you do feel the need to have a religious story, remember the swine herd Jesus drove the demons into.
Sorry, I have had Alexander the Great and Greco-Bactrians in the back of my mind, so Buddhists.
Even the criminal gang hypothetically doesn’t need to have ethno-religious reasons for not eating the tainted pork. I was just acknowledging @silveroak ‘s comment.
I do not remember the swine herd that Jesus drove demons into. I will look it up
Matthew 8:28, Luke 8:26
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I’m thinking the infernal ritual to intentionally create a religious aura is about purposefully violating religious strictures. Now obviously every religion has a variation of “Thou shalt not kill (without our orders)”, but simply murdering someone and feeding them to pigs isn’t much different than leaving the body for wolves or other scavengers unless there is something more specific to it.
Of course murdering people repeatedly in the same spot will always have a chance to create an infernal aura, but if the bodies are just being disposed of there that’s an entirely different issue, and the religious prohibition becomes part of the question again.
There is a major difference between occasionally feeding the pigs a dead body (all of which the gang might not even have murdered, sometimes you just need a body to disappear) and actively killing people to feed the pigs, especially if there is some ritualistic aspect of the process.
It is similar to the discussion about the magic gar fish that generated vis by eating dead bodies. If the occasional person was fed to it, because hey dead body disposal and vis, there is only a minor chance of infernal though the church would be really upset if they learned about it. But if instead you symptomatically fed it bodies to produce the maximum amount of vis, including killing people when bodies were not otherwise available, high chance of infernal.
So it comes down to as Silveroak stated, are they using it just to dispose of bodies or are have they actually ritualized the process?
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When I first posed the hypothetical, it was “occasional” body. Only a few, now and then.
But also specified was that the gang ensures that the eventual pig meat is only consumed by their enemies.
What constitutes a ritual?
I specifically gave a range between the original activity to something likely to produce an aura, without going into something that was specifically being done to generate an aura.
Ritualistic verse actual ritual. The former covers things that look like ritual but do not have to actually be a ritual in the magic/religion sense. If the gang develops specific order in killing or preparation of the body to feed the pigs. Not in the “eh, juz’ chop em up and feed em ta da pigs” sense but in the Dexter sense. Prepare the area, deconstruct the bodies in a fairly precise and consistent manner, then transport and feed the parts to the pigs in a fairly precise and consistent manner. It does not have to be a formal ritual, but once you start taking on aspects of a ritual (it becomes ritualistic) then the chances of an infernal aura increase. You are giving hell the chance to say “Hey, this counts as a ritual!”.
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Purpose is part of it too, right? If they start to see feeding bodies to pigs as worthwhile in its own right, not just tidying up, that's more Infernal.
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Yes purpose could and should be part of it. Specifically feeding human bodies to pigs and feeding the pigs to their enemies is something they chose, it is beyond just tidying up. That is what gave at least a low chance of an Infernal Aura forming in the baseline. IMPO, it is not enough but is a contributing factor while your minimum level might be lower than mine. For a SG who wants an Infernal Aura to form though, adding in a little bit of ritualistic behavior would be an obvious and easy addition.
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An Infernal aura may form. Evil does not need to be ritual, although this comes close; they are murdering people and disposing of bodies in a consistent way. Perhaps a demon starts paying attention.
I’d have the swine herd prefer human flesh, and those who eat the pork hostile to the providers.
Note: I suppose that implies a might for the herd, rather than an aura. Perhaps the herd gains a collective might, and tether an aura for the pens.
Left to it’s own devices, the herd gets out of hand, slaughters the hands that feed them, and rampages into the countryside. Hell Pigs Gone Feral.
That is a good point- there are a range of outcomes, from an infernal aura to infernal pigs (possibly redundant for Muslim’s or jews), to faerie flesh eating pigs. If you are looking at auras where the killings take place is very much an aspect of the question- throwing live unconscious enemies to pigs to be eaten is going to concentrate the odds of an infernal aura much more than kill them one pace and dispose of them another. Also why are they making sure their enemies eat the pigs? Is it just some sort of concern that the pigs may be contaminated from eating bodies but they aren’t going to worry if their enemies eat it or is this some sort of revenge motive where they are hoping to curse their enemies through this… well at that point it would be a ritual, whether an effective one or not.
Realistically given the way infernal auras work “feeding bodies to pigs” is the least of the factors involved.(unless you are going to start talking about the eye color of the assassins as well, or something eually trivial)
The medieval mindset cared a lot about the treatment of dead bodies. I think killing people and feeding them to pigs is significantly more Infernal than killing people and burying them.
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There are also a range of variations: vultures or carrion crows, flesh-stripping beetles (Dermastid beetles exist in Europe), rats, your local butcher shop (for the Warhammer Old World-minded SG).
Most of those leave behind bones, though, which is less of an issue with pigs. Pigs are also powerful once above a size, and destructive, and boars are known hazards.
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Going purely RAW, feeding bodies to pigs would be an act of desecration and thus a major sin.
Then you need to roll a stress die+temporary infernal aura rating at EF of (6+dominant aura rating). If it succeeds, the infernal aura forms at a rating of 1. If there already is 1, it increases. The rules are detailed in RoP Infernal pg 11.
Technically this would trigger for any major sin- however, I’d use the sidebar on that same page for reference and add a “cap” so to speak based on the severity of the sin. An Infernal aura rating of 2 sounds about right to me in this case, although it’s certainly an eyeball.
I wouuld suggest not rolling every time, since it seems this an occasional occurence- rather, the gang probably over time succeeded on multiple checks. Also, auras sometimes benefit from vibe based treatment.
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