Magic Adiction + flawless magic

K, i got flawless magic and i wanna take magic adiction... so 'allways stress dice for casting spells' with flawless magic... and when u use stress dice for casting u will cast again and again and again. What do u think? Its clear for me that the stress dice is just for the BONUS when you are relaxed but i must persuade my troupe.

Hi, i am creating a magus character with magic adiction + flawless magic. What do you think? When u have a spell mastered you allways roll a 'stress' dice, this mind even in relaxed situations my character will cast again and again out of control?

You cast your spells perfectly but you still crave the rush of magic, maybe more since your magic is better refined.

So yes I think you are at risk of casting a lot of spell. You might want to invest in a little bit of Concentration.

Spirit of the rules, I'd say no. Letter of the rules, I'd say yes. I have a character who has this exact problem, but in short, it isn't a problem. Any roll worth making should really be a stress roll, anyway, IMO.

In addition to Concentration, invest in Imperturbable casting. Controlling addiction is directly related to the spell, as it is a function of the spell's level.

Is that a new virtue/flaw? If so, from what book?

It's not "new" but it is not in the core book.
Houses of Hermes:Societates, page 33. And it's not one of the ones limited to the Cult of Mercury.

Mastered spells are always "stress die", even if there is no botch.

But specifics aside, The Rules state (p , col 1 mid) that any Flaw that is not a "flaw" (that either "hinders a character" or "enhances the story", in the context of THAT Saga) is not a Flaw, and the character should not be allowed to take it.

But (at face value, specifics of the Saga aside) this ain't that (even if Flawless Magic takes a big part of the risk out of it).

This is certainly a problem any time Fatigue is a problem, and any time subtlety or discretion is a concern. But the SG and Troupe have ultimate veto power.

  1. I was unaware that 'u' alone was a word in english? Grammatically it appears to have the same value as the word 'you', but I'm not a native speaker and am possibly unaware of this word?
  2. Nope. By the rules, Flawless Magic does mean that you must always check concentration to resista casting another spell. But at least it will be relatively cheap to buy Impertuable Casting for a bit of a bonus on that particular roll. :slight_smile:

sorry about:

  1. double post, i never saw the first and i tought that an error ocurried.

  2. my horrible grammar and ortography, my spanish is better, be sure.

The concentration bonus for master dont work avoiding the adiction. and the cold law said the adcited must roll allways she cast a mastered spell, but i think the stress dice with no botch dice is just like a simple dice.

I posted in the other thread. I'll reiterate some of what I said there, here.
Without the mastery ability Imperturbable Casting you can't use the mastery score as a bonus to the concentration roll, but with that mastery ability you can, as the concentration roll for addiction is directly related to the spell cast (half the level of the spell is the ease factor, so there's the direct relationship). Imperturbable Casting was first published in Houses of Hermes:Societates.

Yes, "u" = abbreviation for "you". Been around a while ("i u", etc), but got popular w/ txt mssg'g. wtevR

(Edit - duplicate threads merged, no need for a link from that one to this one repeated here)

First, it's not - it specifically says "stress die". Botch, no botch - not important.

But more, it's simply not legal to get Virtue points from a Flaw that is not "a flaw". See above post.

I've used my spaminater powers for good.... this time
(threads merged)

I'm ok with it. The flaw makes the virtue less good and imposes some real problems, which the player is essentially asking the GM to provide. A magus' options for the second round are very limited. Cast a big spell? Next round, no fast cast defense unless it is at least as big, no action other than casting a spell that is at least as big, etc. Cast a fatiguing spell? Next round, cast a spell at least as big. And maybe the round after.

The combination even makes sense IC: He developed a flawless technique from casting so often.

I see this as very different from taking, say, Difficult Longevity Ritual and Magical Being at character creation.

But, you know, MMVs...


Not, really, you can do fast cast defense, if it is a spontaneous spell. The formulaic spell must be the same level, but it could be any spontaneous effect and you spend fatigue for it. Which can make the next addiction check roll really low, too, in the case of a 5th or 10th level effect. So, if I fail the addiction check on a 35th level spell, and next round fatigue myself for a 5th level spell, I'm checking addiction against a 5th level spell, AND I get the +3 bonus to control the addiction. If I have to cast a fast cast defense, and I don't have it mastered for fast casting, I'm fatiguing myself, which is allowed.

It's cast a spell just as big, if formulaic, or cast any spell which is fatiguing, even low leveled ones are fine. The requirements are a spell of the same level, or a spontaneous spell which you fatigue yourself for.

A good virtue for this character is Cautious with concentration. Botching on a concentration roll is almost as bad as a combat botch. And combat botches are really deadly (especially on defense).

Fair enough. Although the fastcast spontaneous spell risks all those botch dice and FM helps not at all. So there you have this very mastered spell that you would love to fastcast without risk, but you can't because it isn't big enough, so have to resort to a lower level and risky spont. The flaw is doing its job.

Is the combination of FM+MA better than doing nothing? Probably. But if taking N flaws and N virtues resulted in less effective characters, many players wouldn't bother.

(I find it fascinating that so many rpg rules advise GMs to be careful about players who take flaws that aren't limiting yet fail to advise GMs to be careful about players who take virtues that aren't helpful.)

Sure, fast cast spontaneous spells don't take advantage of Flawless Magic, but then, not every spell a magus has with Flawless Magic will be mastered for fast casting, anyway.

That's kind of the point of the whole virtue and flaw system. You take virtues, and pay for them with flaws, and overall it makes one less effective, or challenges the character with regards to story or personality flaws.

Which is why I said earlier, that enforcing the addiction check is within the letter of the rules, but not the spirit of the rules. The purpose of the stress die, with no chance of botch, for a mastered spell is to grant unlimited potential to the final score.

Speaking as the SG for Jonanthan's character who has this exact combination, all I can say is that I am perfectly fine with it. He rolls to control his addiction all the time, it's affected the whole way his character is designed (so that he's a generalist with moderate level spells, instead of a specialist with high level ones), its created tons of roleplaying, and he finally botched a concentration check last session ... while about to confront infernalists in the Cave of Bonisagus. He ended up exhausting himself with spontaneous magic, which affected the entire encounter that followed.

I got no problem with this combination of Virtue and Flaw.

It isn't the combination of the virtue and flaw, it is the flaw and spell mastery. The idea is that one masters a spell to use it more safely, more consistently. So, this is where I say the spirit of spell mastery isn't represented in Magic Addiction causing one to roll to control the addiction.
Perhaps in situations where the spell is mastered, and there isn't a chance of botch, or it is entirely mitigated through reducing botch dice to zero, the concentration roll shouldn't be subject to botching. Failure is still a problem and might make the next concentration roll subject to botch.