Many new spells to discuss about

Hammer of Thor (CrReAu 30, Touch, Sun, Individual, Base 3 for a small lightning +4 for unnatural, free requisite for controlling the lightning)
Version 1: Enchants a metal weapon in a way that it is covered by small lightnings, at the first hit of the weapon the energy of the weapon is set free, dealing 15 points of damage, after a hour the energy has restored, additionally the weapons deals 3 points of extra damage (everytime)
Version 2: Enchants a metal weapon in a way that it is covered by small lightnings, this weapon has now an extra +5 dmg bonus to its normal statistics.
Version 3: Enchants a metal weapon that it is covered by strong lightnings (for a final level of 40) that deals +30 dmg at every hit.

I personally prefer version 1, because this forces the char who wields the weapon to make some thoughs about which target he hits first.

Spiders Clothes (CrAn 60, Ritual, Touch, Mom, Group, Base 5 +5 Size, +1 treatend material, +2 extreme good silk)
Creates an whole bunch of finest spider silk woven to a giant bolt of cloth, this spidersilk is so resstent against cutting or damaging that a shirt adds 1 to your soak, a robe or a set of shirt, throusers and cloak adds +3 to your soak roll(like in the spell "Doublet of Impenterable Silk"), additionally the silk works a bit like the leaves of a lotus flower: dirt and water pearls off. To make clothing of the silk you need tools crafted and entchanted by a Verditius or something simular.
This Ritual was invented by the Bjornair Magus Ursus the White, after making a whole bunch of these robes and selling them for 2 pawns of Vis each at the Grand Trubunal (selling them to over 100 magi) he became on of the richest and best-known wizards.
Because of spells like "Weavers Trap of Webs" and the shapechanging abilitys of magi I would think that at least some Animal masters know about the power of spider silk, so it is no "modern thinking" spell to create kevlar wests or something.

Airs Shield (MuAuTe25, Touch, Diameter, Part, Requisite free Base 10)
This spell changes the air around the caster to a substance that deflects fast objekts like arrows, swords, rocks or something like that, granting the caster a +15 soak against these things. Slow objekts arent hindered.
Because a Rego terram spell with a simular level would protect the caster from all metal weapons or spells like "Shriek of the Impending Shafts(InHe15)" that gives boni of +9 to dodging the +15 soak boni shpuld be finde but a +10 soak would also be ok.

Airs Aegis
(MuAuTe40 Sun, Voice, Part, Size +1 Base 10)
This spell changes the air around a point the acster designates to a substance that deflects fast objekts like arrows, swords, rocks or something like that, granting the caster a +15 soak against these things. Slow objekts arent hindered. The shield has the form of an 20 paces high dome with a radius of 20 paces.
The same as for Airs Shield.

Calling the Cloud (CrAu20 Individual, Moon, Touch, Base 2, +2 unnatural)
Creates a normal Cloud at touch range wich stays at least a few minutes at the creation point

Clouds Castle (MuReAuTe30, Touch, Moon, Individual, Req +1, Base 5)
Changes a normal Cloud to a gelee-like substance wich flyes and that can be reshaped trough normal tools like wood or ice, it can carry nearly 10.000 pounds and can fly at a speed of 5 miles per hour

Angels Fortress(MuReAuTe45, Base 10, Moon, Touch, Individual,Terram req free, +1 Rego, +2 reshaping)
This spell turns a normal cloud (something with an radius of 50 paces) into a cloud that is as light as a normal cloud but is as hard as stone, also it reshapes one part of the clound to a wizard tower with walls of "cloudstone", buildings for grogs and animals and so on, this cloud can be directed by the caster and can move at a speed of 10 miles/hour

[b]Ring of Light/b(Base 4, Touch, Ring, Individual)
Enchants a object sourunded by a ring to glow and create daylight, because if this spell is cast on a metalring around an object(like a torch or a candle or a cold, soulless metal rod), magical lightsources are very easy to create and every covenant should have at least 100 of the helpers.

Call of the Lighning Army (ReCrMeAu50, Voice, Sun, Group (Base 10 (like animate a corpse), +2 Sun, +2 Voice,+2 Group +1 Rego Req,+1 Mentem Req)
This spells creates 10 servants to the caster and directly controlls them, with this spell th servants consit of pure lightning and can only be created or called when some thunder clouds are in voice range. The servants have no magic might (like undeads) but are quite intelligent, thanks to the mentem requisit. To command them is the same as command an undead created with the Walking Corpse spell.

God of Thunder(MuReCoAu55 Ritual, Base 35(turn someone into lightning), Personal, Individual, Sun, +1 Rego req, +1 Auram req)
This powerful transformation ritual turns the caster into a pure form of lightning, he remains in human form or at some point if he wishes (thanks to the Rego req but this requires concentration) but he is capable of travel at the speed of a lightning (but only from one point to another like from one housetop to a tree to a mountain), he can use its own body as a very strong lightning bolt with +40dmg, he is total invulnerable, only spells that go against Mentem or Vim (the spell itself) are capable of harming someone in this state, the items of the caster arent transformed

[b]Eagle Eyes/b
Give the caster the eyes of an eagle.
Cold Mind/b
Reduces the emotions of the caster so that he can concentrate on a bow shoot or something else.

[b]Strong Hands/b
Avoid the normal shaking of hands, so that actions that involve Dexterity are far more easy. With the Eagles Eyes and the Cold Mind Spell this spell gives a +5 bonus on all shoots with a bow. Because this are all changes on the user itself and not directly on the bow or the arrow the magic resistance of a target hit by the arrow doesnt help it!

Picture of the Landscape(CrIm10, Touch, Ring, Individual, Base 1, +2 complexity)
You normaly cast this spell on a page of a book(on wich is a ring drawn) or a picture inside a wooden frame. Inside the ring or on the picture a perfectly copied picture of a non-moving landcape, a building, a obelisk covered with ancient runes is created on the paper.

Picture of the Battle(CrIm15, Touch, Ring, Individual, Base 1, +2 complexity, +1 moving images)
You normaly cast this spell on a page of a book(on wich is a ring drawn) or a picture inside a wooden frame. Inside the ring or on the picture a perfectly copied picture of a moving and chaning battle a tree that changes from one season to another, a dancing bear or something like this is created on the paper.

Perfect Picture(CrIm, Touch, Ring, Individual, Base 3, +2 complexity, +1 moving images)
You normaly cast this spell on a page of a book(on wich is a ring drawn) or a picture inside a wooden frame. Inside the ring or on the picture something or someone is created on the paper that moves, makes sounds and smells as the caster wishes. With this spell you can create a singng trubadore that sometimes uses his skills to play with balls, tells you some (defined) storys or you can create a picture of a kitchen in which a meal is amde and can wath the maid who do this, hear the sound of the fire and smell the food when it is ready.

Picture of the Lady(CrImMe40, Touc, Ring, Individual, Base 2, intricacy, +6 Mentem requisite as in the spell "The Shadow of Human Life CrImMe40)
You normaly cast this spell on a picture inside a wooden frame. A person inside the picture is created which has simulated intellect and functions as an independent human, albeit a stupid one capable of interpreting general orders in new situations.
With this spell the magus Larius ex Jerbiton protected his lab and his sancta, the guarding Lady was capable to see if someone was a univited person, ask him for the secret codeword and make a loud alarm sound that coukld be heard in every corne rof the covenant.
All these spells are inventions of Larius ex Jerbiton and his fine pictures created wit his high Finess score and his Free Expresison Skill were sold to many covenants and even some mundane folk.

You've already seen some of my ideas on those, but still...

Base should probably be 5, lightning, just like The Incantation of Lightning. For a Base 3, you can create "a debilitating kind of air: noxious stench, mild poison, etc." for which I don't think a damage-causing lightning qualifies. I might agree with having the lightning "shock" someone instead of causing damage (perhaps causing Fatigue-Pain loss like Painful Magic?), but I doubt I'll allow that too. Too modern. I don't like the whole "small lightning" thing - lightnings are these mighty things striking down from the sky, not small electric jolts!

I'd also say the effect is wholly divorced from its context - a lightning trapped in a sword is no more "in-context" than one springing from your hands. (There are no lightning rods.) So a full +4 for unnatural is required.

I'll also make the Rego requisite cost a magnitude. Without it the spell would still do something, it just won't be very safe to use.

By the rules I think option 3 makes the most sense. I'll peg it at level 40 too (Base 5, +4 unnatural, +2 sun, +1 Re).

Option 1 does make perhaps for a somewhat more interesting "delay the strike!" effect, but I don't really like it. The whole concept of charging the sword is one I don't like. And I don't like tiny lightning too. If hard pressed to approve something like that, I'll agree to lower one magnitude for +15 damage and another for slow charging, so a level 30 spell. But I won't like it.

It might be wise to have the spell harm the sword, like blade of the virulent flame does.

It isn't that spider silk is inappropriate, it is that giving it the qualities of kevlar is. Spider silk would, I think, be strong and sticky (like in weaver's trap of webs), not unsticky and comfortable.

When creating an animal product with Base 5, an Individual is apparently "a single hair" or something like that - which is a bit akward. While technically it might be possible to simply create a single long strand of spider silk, I think it's more appropriate to create a Group of strands at the base Animal Individual mass.

A base Individual for Animal is about the size of a pony (Size +1) in bulk. I'd say that's enough to make, oh, 10 robes. So I'd say no more than +3 size is really needed to get to 100 robes.

Not sure about the +2 needed for the fine quality thingie. As weaver's trap of webs doesn't require it, I don't think you should either.

So I would say Base 5, +1 treated materials (creating bare thread, not fabric!), +2 Group, +3 size for level 35. The spell creates strands of spider silk in a total mass sufficient to create 100 robes (Size +4). At level 40, it will create the robes or cloth directly. The robes act as an armor providing +3 soak at no Load.

They aren't smooth, so water and so on don't slide off them. In fact, they are probably a bit sticky and uncomfortable so it's advised to wear some undergarments beneath the robes. (Perhaps capes might make a better choice.)

A material that is as soft and pleasant as silk but imbued with the strangth of spider silk would be a magical material IMO - indeed, silk modifier by doublet of imenetrable silk.

You can imbue air with the impenetrability of steel or something like that, but then it will also resist any objects and movement (including your own's). That isn't what you want. You want the spell to stop only fast-moving objects - sorry, you're not thinking about changing the air, you're thinking about altering the flight of objects, a Rego Herbam/Terram effect.

The closest I can think of is imbuing the air with the thickness of honey or a similar viscous fluid. I'd say that's highly unnatural for air, so it is Base 10 - and perhaps an Aq requisite. The air's viscosity will slow everything down, effectively granting anyone within it a +15 to Soak against projectiles such as arrows. Movement is also slowed, and melee attacks are slowed too so suffer a -2 penalty to Attack and furthermore a -3 penalty to Damage. (The numbers are purely off the top of my head, so don't hold me to them.)

A base Individual for Auram is a single weather phenomenon (one cloud, one wind, etc.) within a standard Boundary (100 paces across). I can live with "The air around the caster" considered to be a Part of that; I'll probably limit it to fairly near the caster (basically the air he 'carries with him' so to speak) or simply to a range of 50 paces.

So I get:
Sphere of Airy Protection
MuAuAq 25 (Base 10, +1 touch, +1 diameter, +1 part, free requisite)
The air around within 50 paces of you acquires the viscosity of a thick liquid. You appear to be at the center of a honey-color tainted somewhat translucent sphere. You and anyone standing near the center of the area enjoy a +25 to Soak against ranged weapons fired from outside the sphere, and melee attacks against you are at a -2 Attack and -3 Damage penalty. Movement through the transformed air is difficult, fast (walking-speed) movement requiring an EF 12 Strength check. Long efforts (such as swinging melee weapons or moving for more than a round or two) will require exertion (Fatigue loss). The SG should decide what penalties and costs apply on a case-by-case basis.

Probably increase target by +1 magnitude and call it "Special".

Same as sphere of airy protection above, only the sphere is 50 paces in radius and the level is increased by +10 (Voice +1 magnitude, Sun +1 magnitude).

I'd be willing to say a cloud at ground level is only slightly unnatural (for the possibility of creating it indoors). So I'll lower the level by 5.

Base 5 seems right, although I wouldn't scoff at Base 10.

The ability to direct the cloud's flight is another effect altogether. I will remove it from the spell - each spell does one thing - and remove the Re requisite (and the +1 magnitude that goes with it). So I have

Clouds Castle
MuAuTe25 (Touch, Moon, Individual, Base 5)
Changes a normal cloud to an unnatural substance with the rigidity of wood or ice. It can be shaped with carpentry or similar tools. The cloud still floats on the winds just like a normal cloud, but its newfound regidity holds it from dispersing. It can carry a great weight, as much as 10,000 pounds for a large cloud.

You are cramming different effects into a single spell. That's not very gentelmany. Design a spell to shape the unaltered cloud (ReAu 15: Base 3, +1 great precision, +1 touch, +2 sun). Design a second spell to make the cloud hard as stone (as you have above, but perhaps this time with a Base 10). Design a third spell to move the cloud at your mental command (ReAu 15: Base 3, +1 touch, +1 concentration, +1 precision, +1 great speed).

I haven't looked at other Rego guidelines, which perhaps might be more appropriate, nor at the rules for Rego Craft in Covenants.

Yep, nothing wrong with something like that. Also, rings on the ceiling can provide "foggy" or "sunny day" illumination.

This spell purpots to call a spirit of lightning from a nearby storm. I'd base it on the Rego (Form) guidelines in TMRE p. 28: ReAu Base 15. The lightning storm can serve as an arcane connection to the spirits, and I'll assume the caster knows their "names". I'll thus make the spell as follows:

Call the Lightning Army
ReAu 45 (Base 15, +2 sun, +1 touch, +2 group, +1 control spirit)
This spell summons 10 jahn, arab air elementals and warriors composed of lightning and whirlwhind. They have Magic Might 10. They will obey the magus for hte duration of the spell or their destruction, at which point they dissipate into thin air.

Stats will follow a human warrior's, with immunity to electricity damage and a bit of extra damage to represent their lightning swords.

Not sure I'm very pleased with this, but that's a better start I think.

Beyond Hermetic limits. He is still Corpus behind the spell, so Corpus spells will affect him - you need a Mystery to change that. He is also lightning, so Auram will affect him. I wouldn't say Vim though, as he hasn't any Might.

I'd say Base 30, too. Also Auram is a must so doesn't increase level. So...

God of Thunder MuReCoAu45 (Base 30, Personal, Individual, Sun, +1 Rego req)
This powerful spell turns the caster into pure lightning. He can switch back and forth between lightning and human forms by concentrating for a round. As lightning, he is immune to most physical harm but subject to Auram spells. He can travel at great speed, by moving to and from clouds or crawling upon the ground. His mere touch causes great damage to any physical object or being, causing +30 damage per round.
Items carried by the caster are not transformed. The caster cannot use words or gestures while in lightning form.

Which do what... ? I'd say provide a +3 bonus to Perception checks involving sight, i.e. granting the Keen Eyes virtue.

That's Base 5, plus say +1 for D:Diameter so level 10.

That's Base 4 I think, not Base 2 (losing control is not like exerting control). Add +1 for D:Diameter for level 5 indeed. The combination note is fine, although I'd put the bonus at +3 (one EF step).

Troublesome. I'd say "image" instead of "picture" to emphasise the caster isn't painting but rathre duplicating the natural image. I can go different ways with this (the ReIm version "stealing" the person's image is very appealing), but I think the simplest is as follows:

CrIm 5 (Base 1, +1 touch, +2 ring, +1 complexity)

+1 complexity as the image isn't moving. You need to make a Finesse check of 6+.

Now you need +1 for complexity and +2 for moving images, which comes out to the same level. Again, a Finesse of 6+ is needed.

I would have made it by considering it a CrMe effect with an Im requisite, but following the shadow of human life is certainly acceptable.

Some very nice spells. :slight_smile:

How about some of it hurting the wielder??

I agree with YR7's edits, though I think that "God of Thunder" would also require a Vim requisite rather than just Rego, essentially integrating "Suppressing the Wizard's Handiwork" into the spell's design. The ability to change back and forth goes otherwise against my tastes, as most if not all such Muto spells are simply canceled when the target resumes its original form.

So, we'd have: God of Thunder MuReCoAuVi50 (Base 30, Personal, Individual, Sun, +1 Rego req, +1 Vim req). Good luck with that. :open_mouth: I honestly doubt a magus would bother adding an "at will" effect to such a spell. Investing it into your talisman would probably be a more effective use of your time.

I also have some doubts as to whether unaided hermetic magic can create intelligence where none exist. Increase something's intelligence, yes, but create intelligent lightning? YR7's point of summoning spirits is much more believable - and doesn't require Mentem. Even Automata, which seem to be the bleeding edge in the domain of "artificial life" aren't intelligent enough to act fully independently.

I’ve got feedback for you. Often times I get annoyed during Ars discussions when nay-sayers tell people “you can’t do that” or “that’s needs a + 2 magnitude complexity modifier and a rego requisite” ( For instance, I think that some of the responses on the "turn into a dragonwith one simple spell" thread were bitter and no fun). Yet I find myself in the position of a nay-sayer here. There are several of your spells that I don’t like, but I really do appreciate you putting your work out here and asking for feedback.

Creating lightning is base 5 not base 3. My presumption is that you believe that creating “small lightning” should be a lower level. I (and many others in previous discussions) believe that creating small lighting is extremely unnatural and so your small lightning, rather than being a level 3 base, should be a level 5 base with one or two additional magnitudes for being even more unnatural. Also, having lightning that springs from the caster and travels to a target warrants a +4 bonus for being unnatural. Your spell presumes that lightning that lasts a day rather than an instant and that swirls continually around a weapon discharging only on a successful strike is no more unnatural than incantation of lightning, I find this untennable.

The sun duration intermittent effect is a wacky thing for a spell to do.

Here’s what I would do to avoid both problems

Develop a range touch version of incantation of lightning. At level 30

Develop a duration sun target group version of watching ward that can hold a few of the spell. (IMO watching ward is a ritual because of its potentially unlimited duration, if you reduce it to sun then you won’t need a ritual)

Weaver’s trap of webs does not make spider silk into a textile nor does shapechanging someone into a spider. These do not provide permissive evidence that the idea of spider silk clothes makes any sense in the medieval paradigm. That being said I realize that my dislike of the spell is personal and no reason for you not to use it if it adds fun to your game.

I believe that a size modifier of +5 is unnecessary even considering that an individual refers to an individual strand. Individual also refers to an animal up to size +1. I’d let the magus create the equivalent of 10 modern bolts of cloth for only a +3 size modifier.

These make sort of a “smart shield, stopping fast things but not slow things. (Are they meant to be like the personal shields in the book Dune?) Why do you think that this would be a property of “hardened” air? I'd throw in a rego requisite to do this.

I’ll note that hardened flesh (gift of the bear’s fortitude) and hardened leather/silk/wool (doublet of impenetrable silk) only provide bonuses of +3 each to soak. I don’t see a good argument for hardened air to be five times as stiff (but I am open to listening to such an argument if you have one).

I’d dump the terram requirement (you’re not really turning the air into earth) and say that these spells make the air rigid and as hard as wood. Then let them function as armor or a shield (+7 soak or +3 defense)

I like this one.

You’re doing two different things with these spells. You are changing the clouds into something uncloudlike and you are moving the cloud. Separate them both into two different spells one spell to alter the cloud and a second to move it.

I would also argue that even Cloud’s Castle qualifies for the base 10 “wholly unnatural guideline rather than the base 5 slightly unnatural/mixture guideline.

Every fifth edition game I’ve been involved with has seen this spell or something very much like it used. It is too simple and straight forward not to be everywhere. I think that the lab personalization rules were particularly clever when they instituted a warping score for getting a lab bonus for such spells. It means that you really can cast any of the spells in your lab and get sensible effects from them and at the same time you don’t get something for nothing.

Lighting is an ephemeral phenomena, I don’t see that you could make a creature out of it any easier than you could make a creature out of candlelight or the sound of a belch. Does this creature look like a huge mass of arcing sparks (like Tesla’s machine in The Prestige)? Does it roar with the constant sound of thunder? How can it hold things when lightning isn’t a solid object? In short, I don’t like the idea behind this spell at all.

From a rules perspective I don’t think that animating a body that already has hands, legs, eyes, and ears is even a fraction as difficult as creating a body out of lightning much less both creating one, animating it, and controlling it.

There are things about this spell that I do not like. I think that the sometimes on / sometimes off nature of the spell is wacky and too much for a single spell. While I think this would be inappropriate for a single spell, I could imagine the effect being produced if it was placeed in an enchanted device or controlled with some powerful rego vim effects.

I don’t think that there is any justification for making the caster totally invulnerable.

Auram is a necessary art so you don't suffer a 1 magnetude hit for it.

A lightning bolt does +30 damage. If you want it to do more or less than +30 you pay should for it with spell levels (I guess I could see +40 for a big mage and +30 for a small one).

The idea of changing into a lighting bolt and shooting to a new position while blowing through any targets in the middle is pretty cool.

I’d do it like this.

Lightning Leap
Muto Corpus (Auram) 50
Range Special, Duration momentary, target individual

The caster changes into a lightning bolt that shoots to another location that the caster can see. Any creatures directly between the caster and his new location take +30 damage.
(Base 30 +3 range + 1 unnatural )

I think that this spell would be much better designed from the level 2 “change someone to give them a minor ability” guideline without the Animal guideline giving you a level 4 spell for duration range personal. Going straight from the guidelines you’d need to be level 20 (change into a land animal) and target part for actually giving someone the eyes of an eagle.

I’d also just say that the spell gives the target the keen sight virtue for the spell's duration.

I assume this is from the level 4 guideline: control a target’s mental state for duration diameter. Looks like a good spell to me. As to game effects, perhaps reduce botch dice by one in certain circumstances and give a +1 or 2 bonus to tasks that require concentration.

The spell itself here looks pretty good. I believe that if the caster throws three subtle spells on himself that he should get a sizable bonus to archery. Instead of your +5 to all archery rolls, I’d give the character two fewer botch dice and a +5 to archery rolls made at targets beyond voice range in situations where the character has time to aim carefully. I don’t think that these specific spells would help accuracy in a situation where the target is extremely close and pinpoint accuracy isn’t essential (although I’d still give the botch dice reduction).

These three spells (and the next one) bring us into the discussion of whether or not a ring can be moved from its original location. (If no what about a ring of warding on the deck of a ship, If yes can you make a floating castle by drawing a ring around the foundation?).

I like the spells but I would be careful regarding the ramifications of being able to throw a ring spell on a sheet of vellum and then roll up the page while the spell is still active.

This spell rocks my world. I love it, everyone should have one in their lab. Some might argue that an intellego requisite would be appropriate in order to let the image perceive its surroundings and I’m probably one of the group that would argue this. But it breaks my heart to argue against something this cool.

Now I'm going to check out what the others thought :slight_smile:

Hammer of Thor
I see your problems with aweaker lightning because a lightning strike from above is truly a big bang. I invented this spell as a gift from a maga the PCs helpes in a task and I wanted to design something the Auram master could cast with at least some penetration, so I made the bang a bit weaker. From game balance I see no problem with the original spell, but if you use the guidlines very strikt it is indeed not according to the rules.
In this case I would use my version 3, but with no damage for the weapon or the user, because of the Rego requisite that should do this very good (and also makes this spell far more difficult to cast than only 2 additional magitudes, so much for game balance) and without additional magnitudes for an "extremly, high unnatural effect" because +4 magnitudes is such a high modifier I doubt it have to be higher. But a Rego Requsite for an aditional magnitude makes sense. so I would give the final spell level (of an Thor Hammer that does +30 damage every hit) a spell level of CrReAu45.

Spiders Clothes
The enourmus size modifier is because aditional size modifiers are better for your vis that recasting a weaker spells many, many times.
I still dont see why magi shouldn know about the power of spider silk: there is already a MuAn spell that is named after impenetrable silk and for this I think someone should know that there may be silk that is in fact so hard. And if I trap someone in aginat spider web and I see that the spider silk is extremly hard to cut and I am an Animal amster I would do some reasearch, at least if I could become 200 years old. So I think magi know more about such secrets than mere mundane people, and I also think they use such knowledge.

Airs Shield Airs Aegis
The thing with the honey-like substance is very cool and good for magi that are good in Auram and Aquam instead of Auram and Terram.
I dont see why part cant be something like "air around the caster" or something like this.
The thing with the "only fast things are blocked" was only another game-balancing thing: if you dislike this (and for your ask why the huge bonus) imagne nearly undestructible glas that is a pace around you with tiny holes for air. This could be a picture of how this spell works (in fact there is no glas, but the air has some properties of air!!!) and I think if you are in a metal cage that sourunds you completly a +15 on soak should be good. Alternatly you could rule the air as a barrier that can absorb some damage before it is broken, but this would be too much World of Warcraft for me.

Clouds Castle
The need for another spell I wouldnt want for two reasons: first it is far, far more easyier to develope this spells one by one and so even a starting magus would have its own cloud, second there are some spells like The Shadow of Human Life, The Crystal Dart, Theeths of Mother Earth or The Walking Corpse which are designed in a simular way that incorporates two spells in one. It should be easier to implant a Mentem effect in an illusion or a walking corpse for the intelligence and it should be easy to first turn the erath into crytslar/marmor and then let it hurt your opponent. But it seems to me that the game designers wanted such spells and I also do.

Angels Fortress
The same thing as for Clouds Castle, but you are right with the reshaping: that should be done either with an additional magnitude, a high finess roll or (my favourite) this spell doesnt change anything in the shape and you have to do it by yourself with mundane tools or a spell.

Ring of Light
This also inculdes the Picture-Spells below: in my saga Rings can be moved normaly if their shape isnt altered while they moving. But in a saga that rule tis in an other way this spells would be useless or would have a narrow use.
Btw: in my saga the magi use this spell not only for their covennat but they also use it as torches for exploring dark caves.

Call of the Lighning Army
The background of this spell was the question of our Auram amster if he could summon air elementals or such a thing. So he and I invented spells that can form something (air, lightning, wood, steel, water ect) with a regospell, but because it should be harder to make something animated from a raw elemental than from a corpse (the same thing Erik said) so we decided that there have to be some intelleigence in such a formed thing. And because we wanted to make it a hard spell we but the Creo and Mentem requisites in this spell that made spells like this very, very hard. In fact these spell doesnt create magical beieng, they are just copies from real elementals, because the hermetic mage cant create or call something like this according to the rules (now with The Mysteries there is an alternative, but incorporal spirits arent the thing we wanted) and their intellience granted is the same as the intelligence from the dumb undead not the undead created with The Walking Corpse!
The shape of something like tis could be nearly everything you want... wirling lighnngt, humanoid creates of pure light pressed in a form or something other, I didnt want to rule that out.
And who said they can hold something? g If you want something that can hold anything air is the wrong element. :wink:

God of Thunder
Oh yes I forgot the Corpus thing, truly he would be still affected by this, sorry I forgot. And of course a Perdo Auram that destroys lightnings would harm him as well.
The base should be 35 because I think incorporal than a cloud is more natural or easier than become pure energy.
The thinh with the returning... hmm instead of a Vim requisite for a RegoVim effect I would make a Corpus effect (+1 magnitude because there is already a Corpus req) for the power to show others the body and face of a human (while you are still a lightning, only a masked one)

Eagle Eyes
You can use your eyes like that of an eagle. g
But why a 20 spell? Just look at the lvl 5 spell Eys of the Cat.

Cold Mind
Reduced both dices on some tasks are a good idea and right I used the base control a targets mental state. I just forgot to write the wole spell...gragajkajajkanfjsnfj.

Strong Hands
Erik you are right in the point this spells shopudn give a bonus if the target is in fron of you or you run and shoot or something, but this should be decided by the gamemaster.

Picture of the Landscape
Picture of the Battle
Perfect Picture
Yes yes the image is not stolen and is not copied the iamge that shows is only what the magus wants to appear. The finess check should be made if you want to copy a text or something I agree with you at this point. The good thing is that you cant roll the papers/pictures because this would alter the ring. But this might depend on your houserules in your saga.

Picture of the Lady
Indeed another example of official spellas that are so different from what many people read from the rules and the guidelines. I think we should all be less fixed onto our INTERPRETATION of rules and guidelines and be more open for oter... but to be oHonest: as a game master I am not a little bit better, when my players come witha cool idea that doenst FEEL right for me I make it harder than an idea that FEELS right.

And to be very honest: I stole the idea of the last 4 spells from Harry Potter. :smiley:

But thank you for your thought and the critic. bow

I specifically suggested that you make it like eyes of the cat: eyes that function as well as an eagle's eyes. (lowered to level 4 because the range is lowered to personal)

The level 20 comment was regarding actually turning into a bird, (+2 duration sun, +1 target part) = level 35 with an animal requisite. Clearly, that guideline isn't the way to go with this spell.

Hmm a new spell suggestion, but because the MuMe guidelines are full of holes its a bit tricky.

Gift of the [Animal](MuMeAnXX, Touch, Sun, Individual or Part, requisite free, base ??)
This spell grants the target the ability to use something like cat or eagle eyes, the nose of a dog or the radarsense of a bat as if it is a natural ability for him.
This spell was invented because some magi used their grogs a hunters with dog noses, but the hunters needed months of learning how to use this animal thing in their faces properly.

The base of the spell is the hard thing: should it be a spell like Mind of the Beast with a base of 15 (Uterly change a persons mind) and a Part target to only change apart of his mind for a final level of 5. Or would the base 3 "make a major change to a persons emotion" better and say emotion is the same as a part of his mind? In this case it would only be a level 10 spell.
I think its obvious that it have to be a Muto spell because it is definitly a change that is highly unnatural for humans and that shoudnt be possibile done with ritual magic to make it permanent.
Or is this spell useless because with a MuCoAn spell like Eyes of the Cat you instantly know how to use your new bodypart in the proper way?

Edit: Also see:

Primal Urge(MuMeAn25, Personal, Sun, Individual, Base 15)
The Primal urge of the caster is awaked, allowing him to hide himself better in animal form: his moves are far more natural, he can use his abilitys in animal form better, but he is also the victim of his primal urge: he might want to have sex with another animal of his kind instead of delivering the message or could be angered by something red if he is a bull and so on.
Needless to say that Bjornaer magi laugh about other magi which have to use this spell in order to substitute some advantages of their hearthbeast form.

Call of Fury(ReMe20 Voice, Diameter, Individual, Base 5)
If used against a target that already is in a fight for his life and wants to fight (so it doesnt work on a frightened peasant) and feels anger, hate, wrath or something like this, his emotions are greatly increased. For the duration of the spell he gains the flaw Fury.

Call of the Berserker(ReMe25, Voice, Diameter, Individual, Base 10)
If used against a target that already is in a fight for his life and wants to fight (so it doesnt work on a frightened peasant) and feels anger, hate, wrath or something like this, his emotions are greatly increased. But he is more capable of controlling him in his fight, so he doesnt lose himself in the fury (I ruled this as an unnatural emotionwith a abse of 10, but you can also use the base of 5 with Control a Natural Emotion and add one magnitude for the control). For the duration of the spell he gains the Berserk virtue.

Protection of Holda(MuHeTe20, Touch, Sun, Individual, Base 4, +1 for turning into treated material)
Named after the german goddes of the forest Holda this spell turns a bunch of living wood into a wooden armor with the hardness of steel and some weight. It has the same statstics as a Metal Scale Armor but the load is increased by 1 for a half armor and 2 for a full armor.

Weapons of Holda(MuHeTe20, Touch, Sun, Indidvidual, Base 4, +1 for turning into treated material)
Named after the german goddness of the forest, Holda. This spell turns a bunch of living wood into a spear or an axe/sword and a shield out of wood with the hardness of steel. This weapons have normal statistics.

Shape of the Ancient Guardian(MuHe20, Touch, Sun, Individual +2, Base 3)
Changes a big tree into something humanoid with arms and legs (like Treebeard or other ents).

Ancient Guardian(ReHe30, Touch, Sun, Individual, Size +2, Base 5(Control a Plant to move around)
This spell is usually cast on a tree that was already enchanted with Shape of the Ancient Guardian and Stirn the Slumbering Tree. With this spell the intelligent and humanoid tree can move around freely to its own will but mostly they are friendly to the magus who gives them this powers.

With an additional magnitude and a duration of Moon or pherhaps a well placed and hidden ring and a Ring duration some covenants deep in the woods protecd themselves with the help of this mighty and giant guardians. But sometimes they are used for building, farming and other tasks. The awoken trees have personality traits and abilitys depening on teh caster and the type of tree (see Guardians of the Forest for the characteristiks of trees) and so some trees are perfect farmers, some are perfect guardians and some are also nearly perfect messengers. Because of constant warping after many years the trees simply stay awake and in rare cases they become magical beeings with a true free will that have no more need for spells to gve them the power of moving or stay in their form (which is not to the rules but it is cool :stuck_out_tongue:).

And a magical item:

The Cursed Tower
Inside a big mage tower lies a hidden chamber with the invested item, a small, golden tower which is a perfect copy of the original (pherhaps granting a form bonus). A Rock crystal is on the top of the tower and the tower itself is hold by a stone glove. The tower itself is opened with 20 pawns of vis, 14 are already used.
The Bad Mind(MuReMeTe50, Touch, Structure, Day, +1 Mentem req, base 5 (as turning dirt into an animal), +1 for stone, +5 levels for constant effect)
This effect gives the tower a simple intelligence but it obeys totaly to the enchanter or someone specified by the enchanter.
The Walls have Eyes(InIm25, Touch, Structure, Day, Base 2, +5 levels for a constant effect). With this spell the tower can hear and see everything within it.
Spooky Objekts (ReTeHe60, Touch, Structure, Concentration, +1 size, +10 levels unlimited uses, the device can concentrate, base 3, +2 for stone and metal, +1 Herbam req, +1 for heavy, fast and good use) The Item can move nearly any non-living object that is in it. Slamming doors, helping the mage in the lab, attaking foes with swords, writing a message to communicate with someone, animating armors, working in the kitchen or something else (ok the food will be bad because the cooking skill is 0 but this is another thing :wink:).
This item was created by Cremus ex Tremere, a famous necromacer. According to his sigil the whole tower became a dark and misty place with long shadows, strange sounds and cold rooms. But this could also be because if the many ghosts which lives with Cremus in the tower...

Agreed. There is permissive evidence on pp130-1 of True Lineages, describing Tremere robes of silk from creatures I could almost describe as pattern spiders. There is no mention of this cloth being more resilient than other textiles, though.
Edit: I think I meant phase spiders. But that's not important.

I don't see the effcet as doing anything without the mentem requisite so I don't believe tha the mentem reqisite should cause a level bump.

Giveing a stome tower a sense of intellegence (rather changing normal rock into thinking rock) is not really relatedto any ofthe guielines.IfI had to pick one I'd probably go with the change dirt to animal guidline that you chose.

I'd drop it a magnitude bceause the mentem requisite is essential, but I'd raise it a magnitude for being even less natural thanturning a pile of dirt into a marmot (after all therre are natural marmots there aren'tnatural thinking rocks) so I'd end up with the same level.

Not only is the cooking skill 0 ,so is the weapon skill, Artes liberales,and Latin. (unless old Cremus hired a Latin tutor to teach the tower language and how to write).

The base 3 guidelie you used was also usedto compute the unseen porter on page156. Ths spell manipulates objectwitha +5 strength but forces the caster to make a finesse roll to manipulate things with any delecacy. I wouldn't make your tower particularily dexterious unless you also made it a bit weaker than +5.

I like the item.

If no one else responds with inciteful criticism within the next few days, I'd be pleased if you transferred it up to the laboratory sticky thread.

I would disagree on being able to give something a simple intelligence.
(as per a human)
It would have a Cunning Score as all animals do , but not an Int value.
The Hrools from Calebais are "awakened" critters with an Int Score.

So the Animal Mind of the Tower could be trained to do "tricks" ,
but is not in any sense sentient (even as a Human Int of -05).

The base level in all guidelines to create something magical is 50.
In this case i would define giving something an Int score , not simply Cunning ,
as being a base level 50 Mentem.

Almost forgot: this should be two spells (one to grant intellegence and one to control it) not one.

That's a bit harsh. We're talking about a sustained effect here, not a momentary ritual.

The base level to change stone into a faerie with associated might and powers in addition to intellegence via the animae magic mystery virtue is level 5 + might. A character with animae magic could change the tower into a faerie with 45 might and associated powers for the same difficulty as your base 50 spell. They could grant the tower intellegence (and one point of might) as a base six effect and not have to worry about the tower being able to see or hear.

The mentem bonus for shadow of life renewed is six magnetudes.

Level 50 is IMO out of line with these.

I prefer my guide line of 10 ( 5, +1 for unaturalness) I'd probably be just as happy with 15. We are dealing in an area undefined by the printed rules where it all comes down to storyguide judgement.

As i am still waiting for several sourcebooks ,
i have not read the "animae magic mystery".

I was considering how far one can go with "sustained effect" vs "momentary ritual".

Looks like my suggestions from way back when
about creating "the magical mouse plague" with Might 50 mice
were not so far-fetched after all.
I could now more easily create a 50 Might Faerie Mouse , with Intelligence.
This contrasts with a 50 Might Magical Mouse
needing a base 50 for creating a Magical Mouse
(with undetermined Might Score)
and using extra magnitudes of Vim to increase the Might Score.

Certainly the Tower idea is a lot of fun , moreso for a younger group of Magi.
Rather than having to wait until your Magi can get high enough lab totals for a 25th Magnitude effect.

Thank you again for critic.

First I doubt it will require two spells, because in the Animal guidelines there is always an option for a Rego req to create something controlled and the spell The Walking Corpse also creates a "Mentem" and controlls the body and spirit of the new servant.

Sexcond the thing with the skills... yeah you are damn right. Gnah. I would rule that he can speak the mother language of the caster (or pherhaps latin), but because he is only a created spirit he cant learn anything fundamental new: he can learn which people he must attack and how long he have to levitate the cauldron in the lab but he cant lean cooking recipes or other thing. So I add two additional magnitudes to the levitate spell to give him more "Dexterity". And I wil ass a spell in the device that allows the tower to speak with somebody inside him and whch allows him to create llusions inside him to cover trap pits, secret doors and other things.

The final item would then be

The Cursed Tower
Inside a big mage tower lies a hidden chamber with the invested item, a small, golden tower which is a perfect copy of the original (pherhaps granting a form bonus). A Rock crystal is on the top of the tower and the tower itself is hold by a stone glove. The tower itself is opened with 20 pawns of vis, 19 are already used.
The Bad Mind(MuReMeTe50, Touch, Structure, Day, +1 Mentem req, base 5 (as turning dirt into an animal), +1 for stone, +5 levels for constant effect)
This effect gives the tower a simple intelligence but it obeys totaly to the enchanter or someone specified by the enchanter. The tower now learns how to speak and understand (but not how to write) latin or the language of the casters origin.
The Walls have Eyes(InIm25, Touch, Structure, Day, Base 2, +5 levels for a constant effect). With this spell the tower can hear and see everything within it.
Spooky Objekts (ReTeHe65, Touch, Structure, Concentration, +1 size, +10 levels unlimited uses, the device can concentrate, base 3, +2 for stone and metal, +1 Herbam req, +2 for high dexterity) The Item can move nearly any non-living object that is in it. Slamming doors, helping the mage in the lab, attaking foes with swords, writing a message to communicate with someone, animating armors, working in the kitchen or something else (ok the food will be bad because the cooking skill is 0 but this is another thing, and if he wants top aim something then he allways have only a stress die with 3 botch dices, but simple things he can do without rolling like any normal human).
Wisphers in the Dark(CrIm35, Touch, Structure, Concentration, +10 levels unlimited uses, the device can concentrate, base 2, +1 for moving objects, +1 for real looking images)
The tower is able to create illusions that affect hearing and seeing inside him.
This item was created by Cremus ex Tremere, a famous necromacer. According to his sigil the whole tower became a dark and misty place with long shadows, strange sounds and cold rooms. But this could also be because if the many ghosts which lives with Cremus in the tower...
This item qualifies for his full 175 points as an item that increases the lab of the magus (because it is like a magical helper, a servant, more security, it could help the magus as a timer, to avoid running in his lab, he can levitate boks from which the magus may wish to learn, he can make the whole alchemy thing in a safe distance from the magus, such a tower definitly is something that would increase the reputation of the magus or would grant a Mentem or Rego bonus and so on), but it also automaticaly adds 1 the the warping score of the lab, giving him the personality trait "spooky" +3.

And what about the other, new spells I posted above this item? :slight_smile:

Edit: another item not realy made in my saga but I had the idea a long time ago, ispired by the spellcontainers in Shadowrun. If you agree that this item iscorrect and I diddnt overseen any rule it would make the Virtue Spell Binding nearly useless.

Spell Container
A simple and tiny metal box with all 15 Verditius runes on it. Inside the box is nothing bot a tiny glas crystall with some Ink of Hermes inside.
Maintaining the demanding Spell(ReVi40 Touch, Sun, Individual, 3 Uses per day +2 levels, environmental trigger +3 levels, base variable in this case its 20)
If any magus holds the open box in one of his hands while he is casting (which may result in a malus for his gestures) the spell he casts will be indefinitly hold in the box as long as the spell is up to lvl 30 and is not a momentary spell. To end the spell the magus may disenchant the spell that is hold or he may use all uses per day so that the spell cannot be hold any longer. After the casting of the spell you and the item may move away but an arcane connection exists from the spell sustained and the item.

What value does this simple Intelligence have?
(if it is deemed important to have an actual value)

To what Value is the Score in Latin (or other language) gained?
Is it the same as the Caster , or can the Tower gain experience?

I can see a variation on this spell being used to create talking books.
They can only speak the language the book is written in ,
which presumably is one the caster can read.

This is a good question: which language understand/speak undeads or animals that you control? Or something like the Shadow of Human Life (the CrImMe spell) and other things... or which are the languages a animae spirit or an elemental spirit can speak. Or which skill in sword use have a animated corpse?
I thing the language spooken/understand by something like this should be the language the caster thinks and dreams in which could be the language of his childhood or latin (I think every magus think and dream in latin!). The language score should be hmm... low like a two or a three maximum.
Exp shouldnt be possible because this wuld be something only the Verditius golems/automata should be capable of. And I think this would breake the limit of the soul too. Pherhaps you should use the rules for lesser ghosts (from Calebais or Mysteries) for these created Mentems.
But the idea with the talking books is cool too.

Ok some other spells (please dont forget the undiscussed spell from the last page).

Sphere of Water(CrReAq25, Voice, Diameter, Individual, Base 4, +1 Rego req, +1 for unnatural water)
A sphere of water with a radius of 2 paces is created around a target. The water is hold because of the Rego requisite and its unnatural abilitys are that it is harder than normal water so swimming trough it and escape is harder than normal and swords and arrows loosing nearly all of its power. With a breathing spell this is a good protective shield.

Holding Sphere of Water(CrReAq30, Voice, Diameter, Individual, Base 4, +1 Rego req, +2 for the Rego power)
A sphere of water with a radius of 2 paces is created around a target. The water is hold because of the Rego requisite. The Rego requsite also forces everything within the sphere to its center with a strenght of 5. So escaping from it is nearly impossible for a weak magus.

Shield of Water(CrReAq30, Voice, Diameter, Individual, Base 4, +1 Rego req, +1 unnatural form, +1 unnatural water)
A shield of water in the form of a sphere with a radius of 2 paces and a thickness of two feets is created around a target. The water is hold because of the Rego requisite and its unnatural abilitys are that it is harder than normal water so swimming trough it and escape is harder than normal and swords and arrows loosing nearly all of its power, but because there is not as much water as in the spell Sphere of Water it is also not so effective.

Ice Spear(CrReAq15, Voice, Momentary, Individual, Base 4, +1 Rego req)
Creates a large and sharp spear of ice, flowing directly to the target like the spell The Crystal Dart doing +15 dmg.

Thousand Ice Needles(CrReAq30, Voice, Momentary, Group, Base 4, +1 Rego req, +1 size)
Creates hundrets of sharp ice needles that flow from the hand of the caster to the designatet target(s). If aimed at asingle target it recieves +30 dmg and if it is aimed at a group up to 10 individuals every one recieves +15 dmg.

A Locks End(CrAq25, Touch, Diameter, Individual, Base is creating a corrosive substance with 5 dmg, +2 highly unnatural water)
A liquid is created that only affects normal metals and noting else. With this spell locks or weapons can be destroyed within few seconds.

Ice Queen(MuPeCoIg45, Personal, Sun, Individual, Base 25 (turn a human into a solid object), +2 magnitudes for controlling the spell, requites are free)
This spell lowers the body temperature of the caster to a point near 0° Kelvin (the absolute zero point of temperature), the caster itself is unaffected by the low temperature (because he is in fact turned into something) but his surondings are affected badly: his clothes will freeze and spring like glas, everybody that touches him will freeze to death, near flowers will die within seconds and so on. He can controll his own temnperature in a way that allows him to increase it to 0° Celsius but not above, so he can minimize the bad effects of the spell if he wants. This spell turns the hair of the magus white, his skin becomes pale and his lips blue

That is a nifty concept, but remember- the book wouldn't be aware of the knowledge contained within it, unless some additional spells were used! (And even then?) It would only be aware of what the vellum/parchment, leather, and ink were aware of, as objects aware of their surroundings and condition.

Just as a stone might know when a word or name was carved on it, but not what that word was nor who it referred to, so the "book" would know when it was created and penned, but not, at a basic level, be able to read itself, nor to recite that knowledge, as that knowledge has nothing to do with the stone or book itself.

Perhaps a complex CrIm?

CrIm- Lecture BookBase: Level 1 - Affects 1 sense (hearing)
+1 magnitude - clear words
+1 magnitude - complexity of control (to begin @ correct page, start over, etc)
+2 magnitude - Dur Sun
+2 Levels - 2 uses/day= Level 7 (? that sounds pretty cheap - am I missing something?)

(This could also create pop-up "hologram" illustrations, another nifty trick!) (and at an even lower level!)