Rival Magic - Legends of Hermes - The Church

Oh.. my... :smiley:


Thank you very much!

This Rival Magic book seems quite interesting, especially the Augustan Brotherhood... :smiling_imp:

Good to learn that the Church will get its rightful emphasis in Mythic Medieval Europe. That one I am most keen to see as it's been a major theme in my saga.

Many thanks for the information.

I agree. I was happy to see a book on the Church coming out. As the Storyguide, I've been having trouble getting the many of the players to understand how important the Church was in that period of history. Many players also wants to see the Church as a villain in the campaign, especially since they play Magi. Wouldn't most Magi actually believe in God in the setting?


No Sahir? :confused: I thought that it would be obvious that they would either be in Rival or Hedge, so color me disappointed. I guess I don't understand why such an important group ( especially for such Tribunals as the Levant and Iberia ) have been completely ignored in favor of traditions that for the most part don't appear in the current lore. Don't get me wrong, I always love seeing new stuff about Hedge Traditions, I'm just a little confused as to why Sahir have been ignored is all!

Well, Soqotra is in Yemen and the Amazons were said to be based around the Caspian Sea so perhaps one of those traditions is a reimagined version of the old Order of Suleiman?

And didn't sahir already appear in one book? I believe it was in the Ex Misc chapter of HoH: MC, but may be wrong.
If I am, it ain't difficult to paint them as Magical Summoners (from RoP: tI), or full-fledged villains with Infernal Goetia powers (adding Commanding and all to summoning, although this'll make them really powerful).
IIRC, you could also probably use the Faerie powers in RoP: F

About the books: color me bad, but the Muspelli... :smiley: :smiley: :smiley: I love end-of-the-world scenarios and ennemies (although the other rivals also look pretty darn interesting!)

Hermetic Sahir are in HoH:S. They are far removed from the 'true' Sahir. To quote said book "the non-Hermetic Sahir have much greater control over their jinn. Rather than relying on bargains to obtain favors, the non-Hermetic Sahir can compel service from the jinn if needed. Jinn-given powers claimed for the non-Hermetic sahirs include immortality, healing, instant transportation over far distances, spying, shapeshifting and even Magic Resistance."

So the way I see it, they have their own version of powers similar to some of the ones found in Goetia. Niall Christie did a good write up for the Sahir in 5th Ed.


But my point still stands, this is a Major Tradition and one that should have the Order's attention ( given that they can get Magic Resistance ). To not include them in either of the books focusing on Hedge Wizards seems a weird choice to me and I was just wondering if there was a reason is all.

By the way, any news on when the ToC for Thebes will be up? :slight_smile:


There is a reason.

The Soqotrans are not the Order of Sulemain.

Also, Soqotrans are Christians in period. Weird but true. I suppose you can have Christian Sulemites, but what would be the point?

Soqotra's a fantastic setting, with just brilliant folklore. It is alien and intricate and shows the strength of Ars's "steal from the layers of real history" approach.

The Rival groups aren't Hedge Wizards. When the cover text says "The Musspeli want to end the world in fire and ice." what it also implies is that, with enough time and effort, they -can-. Sure, the Sulemainites are powerful individually, but they've never struck me as being in the same league as the Rivals. If the Muspeli are left on their own, if the Amazons head west, if the Virgilians continue to scheme, if the Soqotrans throw off their isolationism, then business as as usual is no longer possible for the Order.

The Order of Sulemain have never struck me as game-changers for the Order.

I've read about Soqotra being Christian in the past. That is exactly the sort of thing that most people would miss, but where Ars shines. I'm looking forward to this book!

I see that the ToC is now up. Thanks! I am looking forward to this book, since the Byzantine Empire is my favorite setting. :smiley:

I just split this topic from the original thread, since it's become discussion rather then questions for Atlas. For your reference, here's the original post that started said discussion ...

AUG 16, 2010

Here's info on the three books I have completed manuscripts for, to make up for Thebes taking so long ...

The Order of Hermes is supreme, unchallenged in its mastery of magic. All other magicians are hedge wizards ... maybe interesting to researchers, but certainly no threat. Or so magi of the Order tell each other. And most of them believe actually it.
The four traditions in this book prove the folly of that complacency:
[]The Augustan Brotherhood uses magic discovered in the tomb of Virgil to support its political ends. Its members serve as court wizards, relying on mundane force as much as magic.
]The Soqotrans dwell quietly on their island in the distant east, staying out of politics and looking nervously at an expansionist Order.
[]The Amazons, warrior wizards beyond the borders of Europe, harbor a deep hatred of the Order for reasons that no magus could ever guess.
]And in icy north, the Muspelli plot to release their jotun masters and destroy the world in frost and fire.
How long can the Order of Hermes maintain its pleasant illusion of superiority?

Throughout its history, some members of the Order of Hermes have stood out from their peers, whether for their brilliance or for their sheer stubborn pursuit of a goal. They are the legends of the Order, magi of whom all have heard, and whom some try to emulate. Some of them have left legacies that have yet to be fully uncovered.
Legends are never complete.
This book details five such magi from across the Order's history: a brilliant researcher who extended Hermetic theory, an advocate of peace on the eve of the Schism War, a master of spirits, an obsessive constructor of magical defenses, and the flamboyant master of a flying castle. All have left treasures behind, treasures waiting to be found by living magi.

God rules Mythic Europe in awesome majesty, served by the angelic hosts. For most people, however, the majesty of the local bishop is awe-inspiring enough, and God is served by the priests, monks, and friars who share their communities. The church touches every aspect of life, and every individual heart. Even magi in their covenants must contend with the church, and many trust it with the salvation of their souls.
The Bride of Christ
This book provides background and rules for the western church as a human institution, covering the organization of dioceses, monastic orders, and daily devotion. It also covers the role of women, and looks at the Knights Templar and Franciscans in more detail. As a human institution, however, the church is not immune to corruption, and this book also discusses how some of the great orders of the church might fall to the Infernal. Bring the faith of your characters to life.

Oh my god you've gotten to Soqotra! I couldn't be happier, although I suppose the Mekoli probably wouldn't fit the time period :frowning:

(I'll have to go check my books to see what they have about the thirteenth century)

On the list of places I want to travel to Soqotra is comfortably in the number one spot. :slight_smile:

I'm not allowed to talk about the content in any detail because it is still under NDA, but the mikelhitin tradition is, as you suggest, one that is later than the game period. (or I presume it is so...I'm reaqlly only familiar with it from a single academic paper.) It's also weaker and Gently Gifted. For Soqatra, we have used the layers of folklore, but basically said "What if all of this is true, and then we trun it up to 11?" It's cool...but no, if you wanted to play a Mekoli, you could do it better using Hedge Magic than Rivals.

Is this the paper?

docstoc.com/docs/47034546/He ... -of-Arabia

If so, how would you simulate mekoli/mikheltin with the Hedge Magic rules - some sort of Nightwalke variant or other?



All of these books look fascinating to me :slight_smile: I noticed from the blurb on "The Church" the following:

I notice that this book is focusing on the Western Church. Obviously, there is plenty of material to fill a book, and in particular I am curious about that "organization of dioceses" material. But I wonder if there will also, one day, be a book on the Eastern Church as well, or a book on Islam.

There's certainly plenty of folklore, native and otherwise, that touches upon the island. I'll admit I'm more familiar with the later periods than the earlier but that doesn't curb my interest. Once it's out I look forward to checking out the bibliography. :slight_smile: