Scribe is not a Profession - and List of Crafts

Games Discussion Ars Magica
1

I just relized that Scribe should not be a Profession. It should be a Craft.

A Profession is "The ability to do a job which does not involve making something". Scribes do make something - they make books, letters, and so on.

Craft is "A general term for countless Abilities, all dealing with handiwork of some type". Scribing definitely involves handiwork.

All references to Profession: Scribe should really be Craft: Scribe. :man_facepalming:

Come to speak of it - what ARE the Craft abilities in Ars Magica ? How broad is a "Craft"? City & Guild unhelpfully cautions that Crafts should be based on vocations - to then proceed to discuss things by material. If we do go by vocations, are we to follow the 1220 Craft Guilds listed in City & Guild, which include Metal Working, or the ones mentioned under the "Cost Saving" rules, which separately list Blacksmith, Swordsmith, and Armorer, Goldsmith, and Silversmith ?

In the Verditius chapter of HoH:MC we have an example of a Craft: Blacksmith with a specialization in Sworsmithing, and another of Metalsmithing with a specialization in iron.

I think the line is a bit of a mess and inconsistent on all of this. I'd suggest the following:

Profession: Type

A Profession: Type Ability represents the ability to do a job that does not involve making something tangible. It is usually used with Communication or Dexterity. Examples include jongleur, marshal, reeve, sailor, steward, teamster, and washerwoman.

Some professions are based on another Ability, not on Profession. Examples include doctor (based on Medicine), judge (based on Civil and Cannon Law), and musician (using Music). Professionals in these fields need not take the Profession Ability to produce professional work in it; they use their profession's key skill (such as Medicine) instead.

In addition to their core professional skill, highly-skilled experts often find they need to practice certain social skills to be able to perform at the top levels of their profession. A lawyer may need to use Leadership to manage his legal team, and Bargain to increase his pay. A doctor might improve his Charm to improve his bed-side manner, and a judge might need to learn Etiquette if he is to ingratiate himself to the king.

The line between a Craft and a Profession can be blurry, and it is fine to use either instead of each other as needed.

Craft: Type

A Craft: Type Ability represents the ability to produce something tangible, working with particular materials and techniques. It is usually used with Dexterity.

The Craft ability represents the technical skill of producing something, but often social skills are also required to complement it. Skilled craftsman can only produce great work with well-trained aides, which requires Leadership, and Bargain is also often useful. See City & Guild for rules on running a workshop.

There are hundreds of crafts used in Mythic Europe, but a few notable ones include:

  • Scribe.
  • Bookbinder.
  • Painter or Illuminator. This is assumed to encompass also ink-making, although ink-making can be taken as a separate Craft.
  • Metalsmith, also known as Metalworking or Blacksmith. This includes work with iron, and other base metals such as lead or pewter, but not expensive metals such as gold or silver. Specializations include weaponsmith, swordsmith, and armorer. Note that producing weapons is often legally restricted.
  • Wood Working, also known as Carpenter. This also encompasses Cooper (making barrels) as a specialization.
  • Jeweler, with specializations in Goldsmith, Silversmith, and Lapidary. These work with expensive metals and gems, including alloys such as electrum.
  • Sculptor, working with stone or soft metals.
  • Mason, also known as Stonemason.
  • Bowyer or Fletcher; for simplicity, these are considered one Craft.
  • Leatherworker, which is assumed to encompass the specializations Armorer, Tanner, Pergamenarius, Saddler, and Scabbard-Maker. If desired, Tanner or Pergamenarius be taken as a separate Craft; note that a Pergamenarius is required to produce books.
  • Glassblower or Glassmaker. These are essential for producing laboratory equipment.
  • An assortment of other professions also count as Crafts, including Apothecary, Baker, Brewer or Vintner, Butcher, Candlemaker, Cobbler or Shoemaker, Tailor or Clothier, Tinker (which encompasses also Mechanic and Toolmaker, and relatively low-skill labor including Thatcher), Weaver or Wool-Maker. Note in particular that an Apothecary is necessary for proper medicine and for stocking a laboratory.

The line between a Craft and a Profession can be blurry, and it is fine to use either instead of each other as needed.

2

I agree and this sounds logical: Note a barrel maker is a cooper not a cobbler.

3

Metalsmith is ... not a good category I think.
The Redsmith (copper/-alloys) uses mostly casting, vastly different from the Blacksmith (iron), at least around 1200. IIRC the Whitesmith casts products as well, but at very different temperatures.

And if all they have in common is that they work in metals, why does the jeweler get two (admittedly somewhat similar) metals, as well as lapidiary? This from someone currently playing a Verditius Jeweler.

Sculptor? Again, the process of working with metals (you cast bronze sculptures) and stone (chiseling and polishing) are very different processes.

I like the basic idea, but your list is of crafts is... very strange to me.

4

I tried to keep the list of different Crafts somewhat short, but yes, this does create some problems. I'm not very familiar with actual metalwork techniques, so perhaps it makes little sense.

I had an uncle that was a sculptor. He worked with marble and bronze, mostly. The process always begins with making a non-metal sculpture, often a rough one from clay as a "sketch" even for a marble statue. Then there is the process of actually casting the bronze, but that is given to metalsmiths. Then there is fine metalwork and poishing, which is again rather simialr in marble and in bronze.

So I think a single Sculptur ability works fine, at least if you assume the actual casting is done by metalworkers.

Metalsmith is an official one, I kinda tried to stay true to it. It does seem to make sense to separete them a bit. Perhaps:

Blacksmith - iron and steel work, principally by forging and hammering. This includes Armorer and Weaponsmith as specializations, although the manifacture of weapons is usually legally restricted.
Coppersmith or Redsmith - working copper and alloys such as brass, mainly by casting, sheetwork, brazing, and light hammering and chiseling.
Pewterer or Whitesmith - working with tin, pewter, and other soft metals to make small cast objects. This can include the use of lead.
Leadworker - working with lead, and sometimes other soft metals, to create large structures such as roofing or pipes, using primarily sheetwork.
Jeweler - working with gold and silver to fashion fine jewels. Includes setting precious stones and gems.
Lapidary - cutting and polishing gemstones.

Does this seem more reasonable ?

I'm still not sure if it makes more sense to separete things out like this, or to keep the core rules' "Metalsmith" and be done with it.

5

For my game I made the Craft names a bit simpler to make it clearer what they're working with: Craft Iron, Craft Masonry, Craft Sword, Craft Armor. If it's a craft that has a specialist doing the work -- swordsmiths are not quite interchangeable with blacksmiths even though they can cover the other's stuff, armorers work with both metals & leather, etc. -- then they got their own Craft Ability.

And then I turned my eye to the Profession Ability... and realized the system doesn't make much sense. If you're a performer you're supposed to get a profession. So: Profession Actor. Except... if you're a musician that's the Music Ability. And if you're a teacher that's the Teaching Ability. Or a hunter who takes the Hunt Ability. Do they also need a Profession Ability? And if they do, why don't craftsmen need a Craft Ability + Profession Ability?

I've mostly settled on "if there's an Ability for what you do, it works as your Profession Ability too" just to stave off Ability creep.

6

The simple fact is that skills for crafts do not fit nicely in the categories we concieve of them in today, and the understandings even shifted during the time and probably by location as different technologies slowly migrated across Europe. A coppersmith would use bit copper and tin (in alloy) along with mixing in antimony in a process they considered part of alchemy (which covered so many topics it could take u its own sourcebook). Meanwhile a tinker is a tin smith in one location and a mechanic somewhere else... and the connection is largely in tin music boxes (which sounded, obviously, tinny). There are a lot of weeds here if you really want to get into them...