The Unremembered Guest
MuMe 15
Touch, Conc, Structure
The caster is able to walk inside a castle/covenant/whatever without its affected inhabitants noticing that he is passing. The less discrete the caster is, the more likely it is for the affected to remeber (with an int-roll) that the caster has passed by. For example, if the magus stops to talk with someone, that person (or persons that sees the conversation) will most likely remembering himself talking to the caster (Int 6+), but not from where the caster came, nor to where he went. (Base 2, +1 Touch, +1 Conc, +3 structure).
Notes: This spell doesn't make the caster "invisible", its designed for a magus that moves in a familiar area. He can not use it to get pass guards that don't recognize him (and is ordered to stop any unfamiliar persons). It's perfect to make any grogs or apprentices unaware of your walkabouts, to stalk a person in a court, or sneak to your mistress.
You seem to be doing two different things with this spell.
Making people not notice that you're passing by. This seems perfect for a MuMe effect at Duration: Concentration as you've designed. (Do they literally not notice you, or do they notice you but are compelled to deem the event completely unworthy of their attention? It might make a difference for their future memories - )
Making people not remember that you passed by. To me this seems like it would have to be PeMe, at least for the un-remembering to be permanent. In other words, if the magus stops and talks to a person (wonder what that would be like with the person under the sway of a do-not-notice-me spell?!), then the person would definitely remember the interaction once a Muto spell wears off. Perdo would make the un-memory permanent.
There needs to be an accompanying example list to determine what is "less discrete". I'm not clear on how the caster can stop and talk to targets who don't notice him/her.
Except that if they're affected, they do not notice the caster. The caster must be "less discrete" (whatever that means) in order for the guards to even notice him.
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Muto Mentem implies the transformation of thought. So, if people have thoughts (or memories) about the caster, they are transformed into what other thoughts (or memories)? Nothing? That seems more like Perdo Mentem.
I'm not sure I'm okay with the multi-mode effect of the spell. First, it prevents targets from noticing the caster, but then if the caster is noticed, they remember him, but not where he came from or where he went. Wouldn't it be more useful to have the target forget the caster completely? Especially from a short encounter that the target would be quite unlikely to rebuild memories of later.
The magus, busy with scoping out some part of a enemy covenant, sneaks through the bushes and bumps into a gardener. He notices the magus, an unfamiliar individual in his covenant, but doesn't remember seeing the stranger arrive. The magus walks off, and suddenly the gardener cannot remember where the magus went. Time to sound the alarm.
If this spell affects everyone in a structure, then every Hermetic magi on the premises will instantly feel their Parma Magica attacked the moment the caster arrives. Best not to cast something like this in a covenant.
Also, I can foresee a large number of concentration rolls to maintain this while wandering about a structure, navigating and or looking for something.
Maybe (this is kind of iffy, but the guidelines simply don't do what I want):
The Intellego requisite detects whether anyone in the structure sees or has contact with the caster, and those individuals are targeted by the spell. For any targeted individual, as long a sight or contact with the caster lasts no longer than five minutes, the target immediately forgets the caster as soon as the sight or contact is complete.
(Base 10 "Remove a minor or short memory from a person's mind.", +1 Touch, +1 Conc., +3 Structure)
EDIT--------
After thinking a bit, that won't work, because if sight lasts for more than a few moments, then for a stranger an alarm might be raised.
EDIT2--------
What I want to use is the ArM4 target, Sight, so that only those who see the caster are affected.
This spell causes anyone who sees the caster to see someone who is vaguely familiar, but not particularly important, especially not at the moment. As soon as any sight of the caster is complete, the target forgets about the occurrence.
(Base: 2 "Make a major change to a person's memory of an event." +1 Touch, +1 Conc., +3 Structure)
Muto Mentem implies the transformation of thought. So, if people have thoughts (or memories) about the caster, they are transformed into what other thoughts (or memories)? Nothing? That seems more like Perdo Mentem.
I'm not sure I'm okay with the multi-mode effect of the spell. First, it prevents targets from noticing the caster, but then if the caster is noticed, they remember him, but not where he came from or where he went. Wouldn't it be more useful to have the target forget the caster completely? Especially from a short encounter that the target would be quite unlikely to rebuild memories of later.
The magus, busy with scoping out some part of a enemy covenant, sneaks through the bushes and bumps into a gardener. He notices the magus, an unfamiliar individual in his covenant, but doesn't remember seeing the stranger arrive. The magus walks off, and suddenly the gardener cannot remember where the magus went. Time to sound the alarm.
If this spell affects everyone in a structure, then every Hermetic magi on the premises will instantly feel their Parma Magica attacked the moment the caster arrives. Best not to cast something like this in a covenant.
Also, I can foresee a large number of concentration rolls to maintain this while wandering about a structure, navigating and or looking for something.
Maybe (this is kind of iffy, but the guidelines simply don't do what I want):
The Intellego requisite detects whether anyone in the structure sees or has contact with the caster, and those individuals are targeted by the spell. For any targeted individual, as long a sight or contact with the caster lasts no longer than five minutes, the target immediately forgets the caster as soon as the sight or contact is complete.
(Base 10 "Remove a minor or short memory from a person's mind.", +1 Touch, +1 Conc., +3 Structure)
EDIT--------
After thinking a bit, that won't work, because if sight lasts for more than a few moments, then for a stranger an alarm might be raised.
EDIT2--------
What I want to use is the ArM4 target, Sight, so that only those who see the caster are affected.
This spell causes anyone who sees the caster to see someone who is vaguely familiar, but not particularly important, especially not at the moment. As soon as any sight of the caster is complete, the target forgets about the occurrence.
(Base: 2 "Make a major change to a person's memory of an event." +1 Touch, +1 Conc., +5 Sight)
I agree with Gerg - two effects. Needs Perdo for the 2nd one, adding a magnitude. It would be much neater to stick with the 1st part 'Ignore me'. If the magus stops to talk with someone affected, then the 'Ignore me' is broken for that person. Fits the way that sort of spell should work, in my opinion, and in tales I've read.
PS Pedantry alert: 'discrete' = separate item, a part of something; 'discreet' = being subtle or tactful. Pronounced identically, just to confuddle people.
PPS How many mistakes have I made in this post myself?
As has already been pointed out, I'd either consider Perdo for any reduction/erasing of people memories, or...
...alter the description and effect slightly to state that it doesn't affect memories of the caster, but rather strongly deter any person "undue"interest (from the caster's point of vue) in him (and by detering peoples alertness you prevent them from making embarassing memories about you, I think).
This would (should, I'd dare say) make it a Rego spell, as this spell does not change the people mind in ways that they "could not naturally acquire" (per the MuMe guidelines p150), but rather it "makes a subtle difference to the target's mental state" (Rego, base 3), which seems closer to what you're trying to acheive here (I may be wrong).
Also, as you draft it, using such a spell inside a covenant (rather than "just" any mundane castle) could quickly defeat its purpose since with the he 'Structure' target, the moment you cast this spell I think that it would immediately imply testing the MR of any magi currently inside the structure, weither they meet/see the caster at all, or not. If there's 4+ magi present in the 'structure', I'd say that the chances of not alerting at least one are pretty high. But since it's a nice concept of a spell (I like it, really), to reduce such risks, I suggest some futher changes to it :
Change the 'Touch' range for 'EyeContact' (equivalent magnitude wise).
I'd generously allow the caster to risk testing the MR of any magi/creature only when actually passing them by.
IF you also change the duration to 'Sun', I'd then consider that an EyeContact range should allow the caster to only make a concentration test when he actually meet the eyes (litteraly) of anyone (difficulty adjusted accordingly to circumstances). Which could be less straining and justify only "on the spot" conc. tests.
Bottom line, I'd make it as level 25 ReMe spell (base 3, +1 EyeContact, +2 Sun duration, +3 Structure)
Not with the structure itself, with the people inside the structure.
Necessarily? I have some difficulties buying that I admit.
As I see it, since 'Structure' affects everything inside it, relevant to the form of the spell, for a Mentem spell the 'EyeContact' range I proposed just filter that down to "everyone inside it with whom the caster make eye-contact".
I don't see a conundrum of logic here but that's just my interpretation of the rules. I may be utterly wrong, but my thick skull would need more persuasion than it gets from a "structure implies touch, always" argument, I'm afraid.
Eye contact requires eyes, always? A structure don't have 'em.
Target: Structure doesn't require Touch - you could use Voice, Sight, Arcane Connection - but the Eye Range requires the spell to be cast on something with eyes. You can't mix Range: Eye with Target: Structure any more than you can use Target: Structure with Creo to create a castle-sized amount of jellybeans.
Ah, T: structure in no way requires or implies R: Touch, but is the equivalent of R: Eye and suggested for this reason.
R: Touch also allows you touch the outside of the structure, thus affecting everyone inside before you ever enter.
T: Sight (or Arcane) would be far nicer ofcourse, but also makes things much harder, by increasing spell level.
As gerg points out, R: Eye requires eye contact with the target, and structures don't have eyes (usually).
Tugdaul now points out that:
Which is an excellent question, but one which can be answered: InIm allows the use of (a)sense(s) at a distance, in this case, hearing.
This sense is now focused on the target (reached via R: Arcane) of the spell. Room as opposed to Indvidual means that all sounds near the target (Not the Target, mind you!) can be heard, as opposed to eg what is being said by a single person.
Incidentially, this also means that it can only be used at targets that are in a somehow enclosed area, wether indoors or not.
The Range: Arcane Connection lets the Ears for Distant Voices spell listen to whatever is in the room where the Arcane Connection is.
You cannot obtain eye contact with everyone in a structure at once because:
a) they all don't have line of sight to you,
b) you don't have line of sight to all of them
c) they aren't all looking you in the eye
d) they all don't know you're there
e) you can't make eye contact with multiple individuals at once (in my opinion)
f) the point of the spell is to keep people from noticing the caster.
I would have to say eye contact cannot be made with a structure unless it were magical, alive, and had eyes that happened to look over at the caster and eye contact was made successfully.
See "Loss of but a moment's memory" in the ArM5 PeMe guidelines.
Perdo Mentem can erase specific memories that are identified in the spell, without the need for intellego. Essentially, you just erase all memories of person X in location Y as the base effect.
Target is Structure, for all the people in the building. Range is Touch or Voice. Duration in momentary.
This is really not that complicated effect. In fact, its the most vanilla application of Perdo Mentem I've seen in a really long time.
I agree with Vulcano that erasing all their memories of my passing, after I depart, is very easy (modulo the high spell level) with PeMe. It seems to me, though, that an additional intent of the original spell was to make sure nobody raises an alarm while I'm in there. The PeMe "clean up" spell doesn't address that.
Yes, but how can you T:Room with an AC to a T:Individual? Are you saying you can hear any sound that hits that entity? And how does the sound know it did not come from outside the Room?
I will refer you to the recent thread Casting into an Aegis through IT, where "listen[ing] to whatever is in the room" was deemed excessive.
Because it is a mess, I decided to go along with the extramission theory for magical senses. You may choose differently, but you'll have to resolve the issues above.
You'd only eye contact with 1 person in the Structure, same logic as Group.
Which is to say, not a shred of logic... The group thing does have a slight amount of logic despite breaking the rules in the process, but allowing eyecontact with a single person within a structure to affect all within? That is stretching things waaay too far. You dont even want to know how many ways i can come up with to abuse it.
And of course, the rule about how a target must be sensed, well this throws that out completely.
