Anyone have any ideas or preferences regarding where the Mercurian Grove/Temple and High Priest that Vorsutus interacted with in his early career in the Roman Tribunal is located and/or the identity of such person?
Italy? =9
But really, no particular opinion for either.
The Wikipedia article on the Oracles mentions several places where they were located. Any one of these might be appropriate. Delphi and Cumae seem the most likely in Italy itself, but there are also mane in Greece and Asia Minor.
This is very interesting! Thank you for the link. I think given my intent is a Grove/Temple in Italy/the Roman Tribunal for this instance that Cumae makes a lot of sense there. I think I'll call it then the "Temple of the Cumaean Sibyls" and having a surrounding sacred grove and regio.
The High Priest, since now we have a location associated with an Oracle, would likely be some variety of Haruspex (or other such Diviner) then.
I think I'll name him "Acer of Ex Miscellenea, High Priest of ..."
I'm thinking of rolling these into the below ideas, since I'm not sure what I could/should use these for without seemingly being able to profit from them. And I feel like I've already taken enough items of quality.
Vis Accrued: 30 pawns
Vis Expenditure In Post Gauntlet:
Longevity Ritual: LT: 30 (6pt bonus)(-14p)
Bind Familiar: (Lab Total: 35) -7p
Remainder: 9p
Other Expenditures:
I have in mind a different set of book purchases than before.
- Finesse Summa: L5 Q: ?? (In Latin, Greek, or Gaelic)(Or Norse for that matter, just meaning he is willing to buy a book from Hibernia or wherever.)
- Magic Lore Summa: L5 Q:?? (In Latin, Greek, or Gaelic)
- Artes Liberales Summa: L6 Q:?? (I'm aiming for a worthy companion to the weighty tome for Philosophae in the library!) (In Latin or Greek)
- Classical Greek Language Summa: L5 Q:?? (In Latin)
- German Language Summa: L5 Q:?? (In Latin or Greek)
I'll wait on working up descriptions for now.
So something I've written into the "important characters" area of the Vorsutus Stats thread but haven't stated here.
After the affairs/events in Constantinople Vorsutus left Amina (his wife) there, but took the children with him before being transported magically to the Temple in Cumae. He has not seen/contacted Amina since, though no doubt that is just a matter of time.
He has since also taken on Isabella Carraro, who I imagine to be a lady of aristocratic birth from Venice but also from a line/tradition of un-Gifted Malocchi (Societates pg 108). I see her as being an "old flame" of Vorsutus that as he recuperated after the war was rekindled. Now she is basically the new wife and stepmother to the children. I have been pondering whether she should have a child of her own in the intervening year or so before Vorsutus undergoes a Longevity Ritual and prepares makes his way to Tugurium. Right now I'm thinking this is the direction I would like to go. Which means ... Vorsutus has at least four "Dependent" characters at the Covenant once he arrives and settles in.
"Historically accurate" Divination Summa? =]
I suggest the Libri Almagesti from Ptolemy. Summa on Artes Liberales (Astronomy) L5Q8 (greek). Canon book presented in A&A, the only book I wanted Regulus to bring from Thebes that he couldn't get done in time. XD
There are a few other books (summa and tractatus) presented in A&A that could also be suitable.
Personal opinion: I don't really see a L5 summa on languages as possible. To me the highest possible score in a language is 6 (never seen higher in any book, and it doesn't make much sense to me), meaning a summa of at most L3...+ 3 tractatus, possibly.
But I will defer to the troupe / alpha SG.
We do have possible teachers both for Greek and High German to help us go from L3 to L4/5.
There's this list of all canon books in the Atlas Games page, organized by Ability, with mentions to the source. I refer to it either to have a canon book in hand or to get a grasp of what the source books think are acceptable values for a summa/tractatus when I want to create a book from scratch to suit my saga. Maybe you could check it and suggest values you find reasonable for the books you want?
L5 summae are pretty rare. Regardless of quality I'd like to know who was this author, why and when he wrote the book, if this is his magnum opus, and other details. Even if only to get the context behind the book. =]
(A L5Q10 summa on Intrigue written by roman emperor at the prime of his life is very different from a L6Q9 summa on Infernal Lore written by a derranged Bonisagus just before the fall of his covenant.)
I think that would be a very interesting idea.
There also seem to be lost scrolls from them (of course?) so they could make for an interesting thing to try and hunt down for both study and/or insight/inspiration for a research/integration project etc.
This seems interesting and promising. And I'm liking the idea that this seems to be developing into a more broadly erudite group of Magi/library.
I'm not sure I agree with you there but it has seemed to beg the question to me in the past whether it is really beneficial in any way to raise a Language above 4. I'm sure there have been extensive discussions about it on the boards in the past. I'm not sure though that there is any functional reason to cap a score at 6 just because it is what we have examples of.
It does seem like a higher language score should somehow be rewarded but I can't think of any way that it is. There is this line from the language ability description.
This Ability also covers artistic compositions
in the language, and telling existing tales
with verve and passion.
I don't think this line gets much (any?) mileage. I would think overall that social abilities should be impacted by language fluency. Also likely the quality of any books written should be similarly impacted. But we have no rules for this and I'm not sure whether anyone would be eager to adopt any. The point however is that directly higher skill in a language isn't supposed to be meaningless (nor should it be) and we have no reason to handwave away the potential for it existing or being written about in and of itself.
You need a score of 4 to be able to study from a book in that language.
You need a score of 5 in order to be able to write a book in that language.
A score of 6 is useful when you have to speak with someone with a different regional dialect. Or when you want to impress someone with your mastery of the language. 
In any case, having a higher score in a language allows you to copy texts faster.
Agreed, but that's not actually my main argument. My thoughts:
The books don't make it clear what a language higher than 6 entails. Like, how do two people with Language 10 talk to one another? Given Language 6 is perfect fluency with well chosen words, what Language 10 even means? It does have a few mechanical benefits, as Arthur pointed, but no real context in the world.
The fact that no canon character ever goes above 6 indicates, IMO, that the game developers have no idea either (which isn't a reason for it to not happen in our saga, I'll give you that).
The corebook does talk about Language covering artistic composition and telling tales, but those abilities are actually not dependant on language mastery. And indeed, in later books we see those covered as Craft: Poetry and Profession: Storyteller... because that actually makes sense. If you know how to tell a story, you can do that in any language you are fluent on.
Fully agreed. But the rules actually make language > 6 meaningless, except for a few mechanical benefits not directly tied to the narrative.
But again, I'll defer to the troupe.
So the point I believe Rafael is making is that L5 summae on languages just don't exist. I agree. Max level for language summae would be 3.
That does not preclude the other means of improving a language ability - tractatus, teachers and exposure. Even story xp, for that matter.
I generally agree that the rules don't seem make sufficient use or interpretation of languages as it were. Though I also think they are already something that can become a huge xp sink and would be hesitant to amplify that in any way. Regardless ... that doesn't mean a person with a theoretical mastery of language (Ability level 9) can't exist. And we have them in real life, they are called grammarians. It isn't necessarily super practical (native speakers don't need or use that level knowledge most of the time right?) but they certainly exist. Most Magi and/or interesting NPCs however ... are not grammarians. (Sorry IRL Grammarians. I'm sure you are very interesting in person. 
)
Anyway ... this seems more or less pointless overall in meaningful impact other than necessitating tracts for going above 3 in a language? So I don't think this is worth debating/holding out for a change on. I'll make a revised book list possibly this weekend or next week.
Unless you expect to write a LOT of high level summae, yeah, its a huge xp sink ^^! But it also feels appropiate that the vast majority of people learns about language just as much as is useful for them... thats the normal for everybody, since more than that level and its just "useful" as a study. As you said, grammarians.
But about grammarians... we are in middle ages. The languages weren't so structured as we know now, and were much more alive and variables. So, the grammarian figure (as we know in modern times)... while possible in practice, i doubt that it had much to do at those ages... 
In fact, middle ages grammarians were way different than what they are now (they were called "modistae" and they were closer to philosophers than to linguists).
On the other hand, as you said, it doesn't really matter from a rules point of view xD Unless it's a very unknown language, you can just read a few tractatus in the same time that you would read a single summae and you are fine 
But unlike what you say, i think that it's a completely worthy debate... after all, we are playing ArM. Debates are expected and part of the fun xD
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Another Tytalus at heart, I see!!! XD
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xD
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- On Conquering The Self by Aradan of Tytalus: Concentration Summa: L5 Q: 12 (Latin)
- Lebor Gabala Erenn (Unknown Author)(Book of Invasions): Magic Lore Summa: L4 Q:12 (Gaelic)
- Libri Almagesti by Ptolemy: Artes Liberales Summa: L5 Q:8 (Ancient Greek)
- De Sphere by by Robert Grosseteste: Artes Liberales (Astronomy): T10 (Latin)
- Optica by Euclid: Artes Liberales: T9 (Ancient Greek)
- On the Division of Time by Venerable Bede: Artes Liberales: T2 Q9 (Latin)
- The Speech of the East by Arminius: Classical Greek Language Summa: L3 Q:10 (Latin)
- Interpretation of Tense by Gramsci: Classical Greek: T12 (Latin)
- Sayings & Idioms by Arminius: Classical Greek: T10 (Latin)
- On Argument & Refutation by Donatus: Classical Greek: T12 (Latin)
Thinking of making one final (I hope) virtue adjustment. Since it came up related to Nithyn I read up a bit on Concentration and the more I've thought about it the more I think Cautious: Concentration would help out Vorsutus as well. Specifically when doing his various ceremonial/ritual casting type scenarios and/or using sustainment spells in controlled situations. I think I'll drop his potent magic for that. It seems like something that is still a rather thematic choice for him as well.
Is there anything I've overlooked/yet to complete? I'm reviewing and want to be sure I'm not missing anything here.
The only thing that i found would be:
- Interpretation of Tense by Gramsci: Classical Greek: T12
- Sayings & Idioms by Arminius: Classical Greek: T10
- On Argument & Refutation by Donatus: Classical Greek: T12
In what language are these tractatus written?
Everything else seems good 
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