OOC Discussion

OK, a little clarification about how things work:

After decades of experience with online sagas, I've made a few adjustments that allow things to run more smoothly and (relatively) quickly. Online sagas are always going to be prone to a glacial pace, and vulnerable to (typically sudden, unannounced) player dropouts, but to some extent these problems can be mitigated.

One thing we do is to run stories from the same general time period simultaneously, even if they aren't happening at the same time, or even in the same time period. In our topic headers, these time periods are called "Chapters", and we're just starting on the third one. Because of this, it works perfectly well for some magi to be in the lab or studying while others are out traveling or adventuring. It is certainly possible for your maga to finish her main story for a chapter and be left waiting while others finish their stories, but we can always come up with shorter stories for the interim, and I strongly encourage you to create companions and play them, or play grogs, in stories that don't involve your maga.

As for the guest labs, while my memory about what happened fails me, I believe Salutor is correct that we must have all the extra equipment in storage, because the vis intended to create it isn't in the vis stores.

Scott

As Gregorius commented to Asena, we've had the space since this Spring - no need to adventure further to acquire it. It just takes two seasons to set up each lab, which the covenant hasn't had time to do yet. We're planning to advance more than two seasons in the next time jump, so people should be able to do both lab set-up (if needed) and other study / labwork.

The question is how many labs we have available now. There are two labs that may be available, for three magi:

  • Stephen's lab - given Trogdor's disappearence I need an OOC ruling from MTKnife as to what the status of Stephen is (and whether he's done the lab text translation he was going to do this season).
  • Tasia's lab - I need an IC ruling from Timaios on what the conditions needed are for it to be possible to remove Tasia's sanctum marker to make it practical to reassign.

Well, I don't want to waste too much time wheel-spinning on Tasia's lab. I think you guys are probably more experienced than I am with ArM and more likely to make an actual "legally correct" ruling. Waiting for a letter to get to Magvillus and back seems like a lot of time wasted.

I will re-visit the core book and the True Lineages book to see if I can find any real supporting information. At a glance it feels to me like we can't violate her sanctum, since she is still alive. I can write a letter to ask permission, which might take a while to get there and back, unless we are lucky enough to have a Redcap who can move it magically. Otherwise the only alternative is if her hosts at Magvillus declare her not mentally competent to make her own decisions, or guilty of some crime that permits us to search the space (forfeit immunity).

I don't want to hold up the Saga but I also don't want to make a clearly illegal decision; suggestions?

Removing a sanctum marker is probably going to be illegal save in specific conditions, but I think that a) such conditions probably exist and b) it's not fully clear from the rules what they are. One potential avenue is that a lot of tribunals have restrictions on how many sanctums a maga can have (probably one), so if Tasia has set-up a sanctum somewhere else, that may automatically void her existing sanctum. Alternatively, it may be a right given to covenants to remove magi's sanctums when they expel them (but that would require us to formally expel Tasia).

Basically, I don't think it's explicitly covered in the Rules, so as the player of the Quaesitor you can probably make-up something sensible. Depending on how soon anyone expects to need to do labwork, a delay whilst gathering information / letting a certain amount of time pass may or may not be a problem.

I'll use bullet points since several things need to be covered here.

  • Remember that the real issue with a sanctum is not that it's illegal to enter it; rather, it's legal for a the sanctum owner to do anything he or she wants to the invader.
  • However, marking someone else's sanctum as your own is still problematic--it would likely qualify as depriving the owner of her magic.
  • Likewise, messing with the owner's stuff would certainly qualify of depriving her of her magic. There's a fine point in this case, however, in that the ownership of the lab equipment isn't clear from the charter--but I suspect that, given the difficult of transporting labs, this is a typical situation, and, absent explicit charter provisions, when a maga moves away, her lab equipment is passed on to the covenant.
  • The upshot is that, as, Alpha SG, I'm going to have to find some way to resolve this IC, but I'm not going to do anything time-consuming. Having Timaios write a letter to Magvillus is a good start.
  • Stephen was never a member, so we could just say he decided his time here was done, after finishing the lab text translations. However, it's also plausible he might continue to occupy a lab for a while, since he hasn't been here long, and might not have finished what he came to do. I need to look at the topics involving him, which I'll try to do tonight.

Scott

I think we can say that Stephen (aka "Stephan"), a Bonisagus doing research on exotic magic, heard a rumor about a possible find near Trebizond, and departed for those environs after finishing his translation work. Salutor, do you recall where the translation work was detailed?

Scott

Found the relevant posts now: viewtopic.php?f=50&t=9318&start=435#p219661

Trogdor had planned to have Stephen doing them in Autumn 1228, i.e. the tribunal season, so he'd be doing it now if we stick to that (but he did raise the possibility of bringing it forward to Summer 1228).

Let's say Summer 1228, so that we don't have to worry about detailing interactions between him and the new magi. In fact, let's say he pushed it up so that he could attend tribunal, and caught a whiff of an interesting rumor there.

Scott

That works, and means we have one free lab plus one lab that still has a sanctum mark for three magi.

Are you okay to write-up the contents of the notes at some point? I think we've still got 2 pawns of vis income from the build points which we haven't acquired yet, so this could be an opportunity for that, in addition to info on the previous covenant and ReTe lab text(s).

What could be an opportunity? Having one of the visitors look for it, you mean?

Yes, I can write up Stephen's notes. However, with only one season to work, at best he would only be able to understand one effect--and copying it would take place in the next season. I might be a bit more loose on the covenant notes, since they likely don't have as many arcane abbreviations.

Scott

I was meaning just to add it on paper. It's already in the build points (and is effectively the result of another adventure), so spending an adventure of it doesn't seem worth it unless someone particularly wants to run / play one.

I'd have thought Stephen should be able to understand all of the texts (of equal or lower level, and he was going to start with the highest Rego Terram one he could)? Sadly rereading the rules actually getting the lab texts copied into a form everyone can understand is indeed going to take another season, but hopefully we should at least have a good idea of what's available and whether it's worth it?

Questions:

Can any magus PeTe away some more rock so I can have a bedroom nexxt to the lab?
Which virtues/flaws does this lab start with, eg. poorly lit?

Enlarging the caves can be done, as long as it's done carefully (it's been done once already by Stephen). Gregorius will require anyone attempting such a thing to consult with the covenant's autocrat, who also has training as a mason, and to get Niketas to dowse the walls to reduce the risk of unpleasant surprises (like new watercourses).

Default virtues and flaws are Magical Heating (but without the bonus to Health, because that's already factored into the covenant's living conditions modifier), Superior Tools and Superior Equipment for the first four seasons of use (with a reduction in the standard Upkeep cost meaning that the bonus is only temporary - basically, Portia conjured them and if we don't maintain at significant expense the bonus goes away) and Subterranean.

Others, such as Defective Lighting, are possible but not required.

I think we're now ready to do advancement? Gregorius is currently advanced up to the end of Summer 1230, but I still need to do the grogs.

That would be
winter, spring summer, fall 1229
winter, spring, summer 1230

7 seasons? I'm asking because I'm not sure about fall 1228 (which shouldn't count becuase book-keeping is easier if everyone is born in January) and summer 1230 (is that already past or is that about to begin)?

For the advancement, how are we resolving any conflicts? Wishbone would want access to the Parma book for as long as possible for instance but I am sure other magi may want to read it as well?

This is more a "how does your campaign run" question than any specific request to access resources.

Autumn 1228 is probably going to count as adventure, although you might also be able to treat it as a disrupted season (which is what Gregorius is doing, but he's in the same place before and after the tribunal). I think Summer 1230 is just past.

We have to resolve the arts-opening mess before I can advance Viola. Also, I'm not sure what happens with her lab (or when).

Scott

There must be a way for the order to resolve this, considering the large number of canon characters with major supernatural abilities. Have her Arts openend by a Pralician whose focus aids in just that. Assume the cost to be similar to having a longevity ritual made for you. I even assumer there are standard contracts to ensure that the Pralician doesn't keep the apprentice.

I think you were talking Summer 1229 for your lab (assuming that Chryse doesn't cause the timetable to change)?

How short are you if Fray helps?