Hi,
I hope the players with whom I play will not read this ^^'.
I have read Dream magic, found it very fun, and noticed a limitation is that you can only join one dream (as in "dream" is a "one" individual and there is no "group dream"). My initial desire with this post (it has evolved alot) was to ask the forum participants if they saw any limitation for such, except the "it's the rule as is" or "because it is easier to threat one dream per dream..." but while writing, the need for the question seemed to diseappear. But I'm still interested in your advice.
I'm anticipating a future NPC (antagonist? not sure if it's the right word) in my saga (or a future one, it's not so much saga dependent) and she is a maga with peculiar interests. After having found a way to absorb vis sources and their potential for study (which is a very powerful vis study mechanism destroying the sources ability at a high warping cost if you are not proficient from a major breakthrough [which would, in the next part of the story become a knowledge to be destroyed because allowing it to subsist would destroy magic totally, and that theme was already saga theme 1 we played until last year in the current campaign where the PC had to decide if they wanted to keep the world magical "as in setting", go "full magical" in high fantasy style or go "full mundane" in a zero fantasy world with mainly companions and historic stories. They went for "as in setting" ^^)] she is now contemplating the fact that most elder magi do not give her the consideration she deserves. She sees herself as a not-understood genius.
She can win certamen against more elder magi, nobody thinks it's more than a lucky win. She can write books with a level and quality never seen, nobody believes that she really is the author. The order has even dared to start some investigation to check if she didn't deal with the Devil. How did they dare to think so when everything is just proof of her efforts to become the best Art praticer of the Order.
So, she feels like underappreciated by her sodales in general.
So she is wanting to mark history. Due to some heavy twilight episodes, she learned how the Criamon are trying to escape from the circle of time and having had a dream spell from a twilight which made an insight fuelling a desire to see what that was capable of doing if pursued, she created dream magic from many seeking seasons, finding nightwalkers and the such to get insights. She already got a way with magic to create animaes [animae magic] while absorbing a powerful vis source in a huge aura and after having created a faerie kingdoms on a new island in the Atlantic, where no magus came after her invitation to see her Magic Kingdom for free (she even offered to do the travel), she has lost any desire to be agreeable with others because obviously only power seems to work efficiently.
Now she may understand that "dream" is a singular Target and it's frustrating her. Why? there is no reason, because the dreamscape links every dream so it certainly should be possible to create a group version of dream. Which I see as anoter major breakthrough.
If I am no mistaken, there is no hermetic limit that prevents this breakthrough (and which would require an hermetic breakthrough).
But in fact I noticed while thinking about this, that "dream" is quite a peculiar Target: it's the "final destination" but not about the "who is sent" which is regulated by guideline (and additional size). It's weird but well, wards are weird too so not a bother.
So that breakthrough, part of her imagined plan, may not even be required for it.
What is the imagined plan (at this stade from the NPC perspective, and SG idea... [at the moment]) that maga may have the idea to forcedly push every magus in a physical traveller way into a dream. And whose dream is better suited than the one of an immortal being like a phoenix or such creature, until the moment she can find a daimon who sleeps and never leaves the magical realm and repeat the operation in the dream world.
That would probably require a symbolic range [I need to re-read symbol range but I think it works by association and there might be ways to associate "member of the order of hermès" from many sympathetic connections] to reach every magus of the order because she wouldn't have every magus present physically (nor will they agree... but who says they have to agree ? if the spell affects them because they have not enough MR that's for their benefit, and if they have too much, it's her subproblem: she was not good enough to save everyone and that means she has to suck more vis sources or get sympathetic connections to them.)
Subproblem : magi in twilight and in a regio cutting arcanic connection would need to be found in an individual manner. Maybe needs an invested device to check every 2 minutes if any member of the order is still present except her, and if so, triggering a direction to get them as soon as they come back from their twilight/regio/otherworld event.
Subproblem: magi having resisted the big ritual spell: solution :
1)
get better at magic and penetration. But it might be very difficult against the pro's of Parma magica Mentem. Besides it takes much time for penetration where she can absorb vis sources for art, but she is not the most patient anymore. She thought that her absorbing days were over and didn't keep a register of all the vis sources she dried before... where would the new ones be? too bad the specialist at finding vis are in the dream now and she never took the time to learn abilities because why learn 10xp per season when you can absorb years or more of Art knowledge in the same amount of time .
2) finding their dreams and appearing in their rooms while they sleep using the great dream grimoir for physical movement - a little cut for an offering of blood will not kill them, will it?
How to achieve this when you do not know where to go: The morphean gate spells says that Any physical traveler in this dream may leave through the portal, stepping out to emerge by the body of the dreamer.
And the dreamscape says: Spells of the greater dream grimoire might be able to create portals to the dreamscape, and even create portals from the dreamscape into the dreams of others encountered there.
So it should be possible to go physically in one's own dream, from there to go to the dreamscape, there, use dream interpretation and dream magic to find the dreams of the magi of the Order who have resisted the spell (their dream may contain some specific references to the recent disparition of almost all other Magi of the order which make the dreams more easily find-able). Leap in their dream, and create a portal to their body, take a sympathetic connection and send them physically in the dream.
That way, "immortality" for everyone, and out of time. Yes she is maybe a bit over ambitious and like most people who have a lot of power (too much at at a too young age), she may be quite a bit overconfident that she has the right answer (or even that a right answer exist, but the facts that she doesn't care from the start about what is thought of her, that she has already committed two things most magi would qualify badly, that she is not very concerned about God and "the right thing to do", that she is very agreeable to demons and not restraining herself from using chthonic magic when it's needed even if not a diabolist in the strict sense did not help to create a stable and wise mind.).
Subproblem: Now remain the fact that if the creatures wakes up, they all reapper in the real world. So that means ReMe the creature so that she never wakes up. Solution: It's only a question of penetration so not a problem if you have the time and the vis. Both must be prepared in advance before casting the grand ritual.
Subproblem: find some way to control the dream so that it's an Heaven for magi. I'll have to investigate, perhaps there is a guideline for it in A&A; but maybe you have ideas.
Subproblem: the dream ends because the creature dies: If the creature is immortal, then it's all good, it can't die of deprivation of food/water. First idea she will have is of a phoenix, because one was seen in her living area, and travelled far in the west (due to PC actions) and she believes her familiar saying her they are immortal. [But she doesn't know that immortality is not a single concept and that phoenix are more of a "resurrecting" being in the saga, which wouldn't suffice since they die... they just resurrect immediatly. She would need a being who doesn't die, but I'll see if she gather the information before choosing the dreamer or not. If not, that means there will be phase 1 and a (to do when the events of the save by PC would happen) phase 2 to do too.
Subproblem: the physical gate who would have sent all the physical travelers (+ the individual one after) in the dream, while reading the dream chapter, I noticed that only those with the great grimoire can create a gate, so best is to destroy the current gate (which is apparently possible) and she can go in the dream in spiritual form so that she can decide to wake up at the opposite of the magi who are physically in the dream.
At the time of the saga (foundation of the order, currently 9th century, dream magic is inexistent (rules say it appears in 1000+ with a maga from Novgorod) so she is not too concered that a magus devised it. And if one would reapper in the real world, the invested item would locate it as soon as it reappars due to the symbol range and recurring trigger. So it would be episodes where she is seen by the PCs or their companions hunting down other magi who would have espaced the dream.
If she would destroy the gate, it would be at the start of the operation, it will probably be before any magus realise what's happening. (Even if "before" in dream is quite peculiar, and I may even use that fact to make PC's leave the dream and be the last survivors of the order and have the mission to save all the others... or not, if they are sent in too which is not mandatory, another current option is that they are not sent by allying with her/or be considered unworthy by her).
Subproblem: Remain the issue of the bodies who will age in the dream because physically travelling, and not spiritually travelling (which would have been better, except they can decide to wake up or wake up if "killed" for fake in the dream, which would require that she manages the bodies and sent them in the magical world and that may be too much even for her... but the PC would have sent the Spider in the magical world when they helped Pralix, so maybe for phase 2. If she had already found a way to get there to find a suitable daimon... it may have been done during phase 1 already and that may change the plan).
But they can certainly find dream vis and cast spontaneous rituals to prevent terminal or lesser crises.Besides, she is not concered with such lesser problems. She can't be expected to do everything now, the magi of the Order have to deserve their perfect immortal life away from every real danger.)
After this, in her opinion, it will either cure the order of their desire of Immortality by failing or it will succeed and give the immortality and escape from Time so much wanted. In both cases, she thinks she will have done without anyone knowing, what all those inferior magi spent decades trying to find.
And too bad for those who had other interests. As every mad genius, what she perceive as their desire overseeds their desires.
Well I tried to explain what I am thinking about for that saga, so if you have any comment from a canon/lore accurate point of view. Obvisouly if there are issues, some things would become new steps in the NPC plan (and possibly give new hints on her plan to attentive observers), some things can be house ruled, but maybe some things would destroy the idea because they are too much part and central in the setting, and I'd prefer to stick to the canon as much as possible because it's more fun to get PCs interact with rules they know even if they can't use them.
Greetings,
Exar.